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CX2SA > SATDIG 07.02.09 15:04l 968 Lines 35335 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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From: CX2SA@CX2SA.LAV.URY.SA
To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. GO-32 status? (John Marranca, Jr)
2. Re: GO-32 status? (Andrew Glasbrenner)
3. Re: GO-32 status? (John Marranca, Jr)
4. HEO naivete (w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxxx
5. Re: HEO naivete (Bruce Robertson)
6. Re: HEO naivete (David - KG4ZLB/M?ZLB)
7. Re: HEO naivete (Nate Duehr)
8. Re: HEO naivete (Rocky Jones)
9. Re: HEO naivete (Art McBride)
10. Re: HEO naivete (Rocky Jones)
11. Re: HEO naivete (Art McBride)
12. Re: HEO naivete (Edward Cole)
13. Re: HEO naivete (Jeff Davis)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 15:10:28 -0500
From: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] GO-32 status?
To: amsat-bb <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<8edcdb130902061210s51aa8ce3r1911373a05f1556b@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Does anyone know if GO-32 is operational at this time? The
http://oscar.dcarr.org list shows no activity...
Thanks!
John KB2HSH
--
_______________________________
John Marranca, Jr
PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122
BN Systems, Inc
Orchard Park, NY
(716)972-2006
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 15:15:06 -0500
From: "Andrew Glasbrenner" <glasbrenner@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: GO-32 status?
To: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>, "amsat-bb"
<amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4E2C9FAB7A0240198FB2DBE4C4826B6B@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Just a telemetry beacon every so often. I'll be sad if they can't get it
back going.
73, Drew
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>
To: "amsat-bb" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 3:10 PM
Subject: [amsat-bb] GO-32 status?
> Does anyone know if GO-32 is operational at this time? The
> http://oscar.dcarr.org list shows no activity...
>
> Thanks!
>
> John KB2HSH
>
> --
> _______________________________
>
>
> John Marranca, Jr
> PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122
> BN Systems, Inc
> Orchard Park, NY
> (716)972-2006
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 15:19:11 -0500
From: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: GO-32 status?
To: Andrew Glasbrenner <glasbrenner@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<8edcdb130902061219t61070623oaef7af18c54ee8e7@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
It certainly will!
So...AO-16, AO-27, and GO-32 are on injured reserve now.
Go Sumbandillasat!
John KB2HSH
On 2/6/09, Andrew Glasbrenner <glasbrenner@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
> Just a telemetry beacon every so often. I'll be sad if they can't get it
> back going.
>
> 73, Drew
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>
> To: "amsat-bb" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
> Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 3:10 PM
> Subject: [amsat-bb] GO-32 status?
>
>
> Does anyone know if GO-32 is operational at this time? The
>> http://oscar.dcarr.org list shows no activity...
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> John KB2HSH
>>
>> --
>> _______________________________
>>
>>
>> John Marranca, Jr
>> PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122
>> BN Systems, Inc
>> Orchard Park, NY
>> (716)972-2006
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
>
>
--
_______________________________
John Marranca, Jr
PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122
BN Systems, Inc
Orchard Park, NY
(716)972-2006
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:41:14 +0000 (UTC)
From: w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] HEO naivete
To: AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<719577154.1053271233952874626.JavaMail.root@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xx.xxxx.
xxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Hello ???
I have never complained on this BB before. ? However, I do have a fair amount
of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO.? The lack of information
from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting.? I read? in the news
about many? countries sending up satellites virtually every few weeks. . ? The
shuttle is going up every few months.? With all this traffic why can't we get
a ride? ? I know it's all about money.? ?In the latest AMSAT Journal there is
an article talking about using frequencies at 5650 and 3400Mhz.? Talk about
scarr ing? away curr e n t members let alone attracting new ones.? AO-40
(sobsob) was supposed to be the best of the best for everyone.? The current
mentality seems to be to put all our "over the top" technology in one basket.?
I subscribe to the KISS (keep it simple stupid) principle regarding my ham
radio endeavors.? An example, when L or S mode is open on AO-51 how many are
there?? Yes, I pay my dues, buy AMSAT shirts, ?and contribute to th!
e? Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found on many of our satellites.? I
build and sell antennas ?and send a portion of those proceeds to AMSAT.? I
believe I have? earned the right to complain.? I have read the background of
many of our members and BOD, we indeed have many? very smart educated people
?in high places.? Am I naive about the details?? No doubt.? I'm just a retired
old ham with a back yard full of unuseable antennas, and a lack of
comprehenson about what is going on (or not).? If this diatribe is all wet I
can take the slings and arrows.? Talk to me about it on AO-7.
73 Bob W7LRD
AMSAT 28498
Seattle
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 17:39:32 -0400
From: Bruce Robertson <ve9qrp@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxxx AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<49657a760902061339o16a815b5v16c6478c3908b17e@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Bob:
I don't think the information is lacking, it's just that the situation
has not changed much. As I understand it, we face this predicament: we
cannot find a cut-rate ride to HEO, and we cannot reasonably expect to
collect funds from our members to pay for a full-cost ride to HEO.
This is a result of the full commercialization of launches, wherein
space is a business first and foremost, and each launch is something
to be sold for its maximum value. When that takes place, our heavy HEO
birds are very hard to pay for.
Avenues are, as they say, being explored. AMSAT-DL is talking to its
government space agency to see if they would like to help fund P3E and
P5 as a package, and they're talking to SpaceX, which might want to
have an experimental payload on a Falcon9 launch. It must be hard,
frustrating work, and I appreciate their doing it.
Meanwhile, AMSAT-NA is really thinking outside the box, asking "what
if we just buy a small parcel of an existing launch?" That's what the
IntelSat GEO idea is about. Now as I understand it, the discount here
is in the fact that we're not launching our own boost motor,
spaceframe, etc. Instead we make some circuits, some antennas, and
they get put on some spare space and get given some power. So we can't
assume that 2m and 70cm are a given here: their antennas, for
instance, take up quite a bit of space, weigh more, etc.
Those microwave bands, however, might just be the ticket. I don't
think it is fair to assume that those working on this are going in
that direction out of a desire for the new or cool; as I see it,
they're just trying to deal with this new reality. The hard truth is
that it might be more realistic for all of us to switch to different
bands than for us to hold out for a HEO/GEO opportunity using the
equipment we have now.
I know the following is something some of us do not want to hear, but
this new economic reality also has presented us (and others) with some
interesting opportunities in LEO. The Cubesat concept works by paying
full-price for the launch, but for a smaller amount of weight than was
possible in the past. I've heard launch prices quoted at $40,000!
(Let's say a 3x cube like Delfi3C costs $150,000 for launch. This
group, right here, could design its own communication satellite and
launch it if there are 149 more people like me who would give $1000
for the pleasure of being part of such a venture! JoAnn started a
threat that explored such an idea. It really could be a possibility.)
I wonder, could we work within these parameters to make a bird that
would functionally replace AO-7? That altitude seems to me much more
pleasing for communications.
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 4:41 PM, <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
>
> Hello
>
> I have never complained on this BB before. However, I do have a fair
amount of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO. The lack of
information from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting. I read
in the news about many countries sending up satellites virtually every few
weeks. . The shuttle is going up every few months. With all this traffic
why can't we get a ride? I know it's all about money. In the latest AMSAT
Journal there is an article talking about using frequencies at 5650 and
3400Mhz. Talk about scarr ing away curr e n t members let alone attracting
new ones. AO-40 (sobsob) was supposed to be the best of the best for
everyone. The current mentality seems to be to put all our "over the top"
technology in one basket. I subscribe to the KISS (keep it simple stupid)
principle regarding my ham radio endeavors. An example, when L or S mode is
open on AO-51 how many are there? Yes, I pay my dues, buy AMSAT shirts, and
contribute to !
the Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found on many of our satellites. I
build and sell antennas and send a portion of those proceeds to AMSAT. I
believe I have earned the right to complain. I have read the background of
many of our members and BOD, we indeed have many very smart educated people
in high places. Am I naive about the details? No doubt. I'm just a retired
old ham with a back yard full of unuseable antennas, and a lack of
comprehenson about what is going on (or not). If this diatribe is all wet I
can take the slings and arrows. Talk to me about it on AO-7.
>
>
>
> 73 Bob W7LRD
>
> AMSAT 28498
>
> Seattle
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:05:59 -0500
From: David - KG4ZLB/M?ZLB <m0zlb@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <498CB447.8060407@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
I speak as a relative newcomer to the world of amateur satellites but
suffice to say, I am totally immersed in them now!
My thoughts are that whilst it would/will be nice to have an HEO, it is
imperative that we replace those easy sats that are coming to the end of
their lives or risk losing a whole new generation of amateurs who like
me will stand in the parking lot of a hamfest one Saturday morning while
Drew gives a demonstration and say to themselves, "Wow, that's cool"!
AO-27 is MIA, FO-29 was rescued thankfully. More recently we learn that
DO-64 will not be available....these are the birds that we should
concentrate on replacing!
Newcomers will spend a little extra to be able to work FM and SSB LEO's
but surely no-one is expecting people to spend a lot of dollars on
microwave stuff for a bird that might not a) make it to orbit or b) work
properly or at all.
I would be prepared to donate $1000 for a share in getting another FM or
SSB bird up as soon as possible and then once one, maybe two are up
there then worry about an HEO.
The way things are going it seems unlikely that an HEO is going to get
up in my lifetime and by then all the LEO's will have gone anyway. The
LEO's are our bread and butter so to speak, the HEO's are the caviar!
Just my two cents!
David
KG4ZLB/M0ZLB
www.kg4zlb.com
Bruce Robertson wrote:
> Bob:
>
> I don't think the information is lacking, it's just that the situation
> has not changed much. As I understand it, we face this predicament: we
> cannot find a cut-rate ride to HEO, and we cannot reasonably expect to
> collect funds from our members to pay for a full-cost ride to HEO.
> This is a result of the full commercialization of launches, wherein
> space is a business first and foremost, and each launch is something
> to be sold for its maximum value. When that takes place, our heavy HEO
> birds are very hard to pay for.
>
> Avenues are, as they say, being explored. AMSAT-DL is talking to its
> government space agency to see if they would like to help fund P3E and
> P5 as a package, and they're talking to SpaceX, which might want to
> have an experimental payload on a Falcon9 launch. It must be hard,
> frustrating work, and I appreciate their doing it.
>
> Meanwhile, AMSAT-NA is really thinking outside the box, asking "what
> if we just buy a small parcel of an existing launch?" That's what the
> IntelSat GEO idea is about. Now as I understand it, the discount here
> is in the fact that we're not launching our own boost motor,
> spaceframe, etc. Instead we make some circuits, some antennas, and
> they get put on some spare space and get given some power. So we can't
> assume that 2m and 70cm are a given here: their antennas, for
> instance, take up quite a bit of space, weigh more, etc.
>
> Those microwave bands, however, might just be the ticket. I don't
> think it is fair to assume that those working on this are going in
> that direction out of a desire for the new or cool; as I see it,
> they're just trying to deal with this new reality. The hard truth is
> that it might be more realistic for all of us to switch to different
> bands than for us to hold out for a HEO/GEO opportunity using the
> equipment we have now.
>
> I know the following is something some of us do not want to hear, but
> this new economic reality also has presented us (and others) with some
> interesting opportunities in LEO. The Cubesat concept works by paying
> full-price for the launch, but for a smaller amount of weight than was
> possible in the past. I've heard launch prices quoted at $40,000!
> (Let's say a 3x cube like Delfi3C costs $150,000 for launch. This
> group, right here, could design its own communication satellite and
> launch it if there are 149 more people like me who would give $1000
> for the pleasure of being part of such a venture! JoAnn started a
> threat that explored such an idea. It really could be a possibility.)
>
> I wonder, could we work within these parameters to make a bird that
> would functionally replace AO-7? That altitude seems to me much more
> pleasing for communications.
>
> On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 4:41 PM, <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
> the Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found on many of our satellites.
I build and sell antennas and send a portion of those proceeds to AMSAT. I
believe I have earned the right to complain. I have read the background of
many of our members and BOD, we indeed have many very smart educated people
in high places. Am I naive about the details? No doubt. I'm just a retired
old ham with a back yard full of unuseable antennas, and a lack of
comprehenson about what is going on (or not). If this diatribe is all wet I
can take the slings and arrows. Talk to me about it on AO-7.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:00:26 -0700
From: "Nate Duehr" <nate@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: <AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <00d701c988ae$b33f0ab0$19bd2010$@xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
The Shuttle doesn?t go anywhere near HEO.
Nate WY0X
-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On Behalf
Of w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 1:41 PM
To: AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] HEO naivete
Hello
I have never complained on this BB before. However, I do have a fair amount
of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO. The lack of information
from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting. I read in the news
about many countries sending up satellites virtually every few weeks. . The
shuttle is going up every few months. With all this traffic why can't we get
a ride?
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 19:28:08 -0600
From: Rocky Jones <orbitjet@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>, Amsat BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <COL106-W9847F18656AEF34E32008D6BE0@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Bob...Your "rant" strikes me as pretty close to right on the money. I read
the missive in the latest journal about 3.3 and 5.6 ghz links and thought
"thats nice, It will never happen".
A baseline requrement for ANY Amateur satellites should be that they work on
frequencies and modulation methods which are consistent with radios that are
already commercially manufactured for the bands in question...or can use some
very easily (think the MDS converters) commercial gear for other services.
The instant the "bird" is designed with some type of radio in mind that does
not exist now and is limited to that bird...then the entire adventure is nice
but has little practical value.
Why on earth is the AMSAT community wasting time on a design which requires a
ground station that is (by the latest Amsat Journal) "beyond the scope of most
hams". Instead of spending time working on making an 'acp capable earth
station within the reach of most radio amateurs".
Because if the equipment has little value beyond a satellite which could do an
Oscar 40 at any time how many are going to shell out the money?
I dont have a clue why the AMSAT design folks seem to think that it
isnecessary to drive up into the microwave frequencies. They never seem to
answer the question why a 2meter 70cm translator is not a good solution...and
the one that we really need.
Meanwhile AO-7 flies on.
Robert WB5MZO life member
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live?: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/howitworks?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_howitworks_022009
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 22:17:25 -0800
From: "Art McBride" <kc6uqh@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>, <AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <6549CA75BF1249439FE86D713599CDD4@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Bob,
While I was only on the fringe of some of the discussions about being a
piggy back on a Geo sat would require the use of those frequencies to be
compatible with the main operation of the communications sat and antenna
system.
Art, KC6UQH
-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
Behalf Of w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 12:41 PM
To: AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] HEO naivete
Hello ???
I have never complained on this BB before. ? However, I do have a fair
amount of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO.? The lack of
information from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting.? I read?
in the news about many? countries sending up satellites virtually every few
weeks. . ? The shuttle is going up every few months.? With all this traffic
why can't we get a ride? ? I know it's all about money.? ?In the latest
AMSAT Journal there is an article talking about using frequencies at 5650
and 3400Mhz.? Talk about scarr ing? away curr e n t members let alone
attracting new ones.? AO-40 (sobsob) was supposed to be the best of the best
for everyone.? The current mentality seems to be to put all our "over the
top" technology in one basket.? I subscribe to the KISS (keep it simple
stupid) principle regarding my ham radio endeavors.? An example, when L or S
mode is open on AO-51 how many are there?? Yes, I pay my dues, buy AMSAT
shirts, ?and contribute to the? Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found
on many of our satellites.? I build and sell antennas ?and send a portion of
those proceeds to AMSAT.? I believe I have? earned the right to complain.? I
have read the background of many of our members and BOD, we indeed have
many? very smart educated people ?in high places.? Am I naive about the
details?? No doubt.? I'm just a retired old ham with a back yard full of
unuseable antennas, and a lack of comprehenson about what is going on (or
not).? If this diatribe is all wet I can take the slings and arrows.? Talk
to me about it on AO-7.
73 Bob W7LRD
AMSAT 28498
Seattle
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3836 (20090207) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
http://www.eset.com
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 00:30:27 -0600
From: Rocky Jones <orbitjet@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: <kc6uqh@xxx.xxx>, <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>, Amsat BB
<amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <COL106-W781CB0E7DEECF60C0E1C50D6BE0@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Art...no doubt...but the big question is...how much gear is going to be
available to "the average ham" that works on 3.3 adn 5.6 ghz...and on what
modes and at what price.
the presentation in the recent Journal seems to recycle a phrase "the audacity
of hope"
Robert WB5MZO Life member
> From: kc6uqh@xxx.xxx
> To: w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxxx AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 22:17:25 -0800
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
>
> Bob,
> While I was only on the fringe of some of the discussions about being a
> piggy back on a Geo sat would require the use of those frequencies to be
> compatible with the main operation of the communications sat and antenna
> system.
>
> Art, KC6UQH
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
> Behalf Of w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx
> Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 12:41 PM
> To: AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
> Subject: [amsat-bb] HEO naivete
>
>
>
> Hello
>
> I have never complained on this BB before. However, I do have a fair
> amount of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO. The lack of
> information from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting. I read
> in the news about many countries sending up satellites virtually every few
> weeks. . The shuttle is going up every few months. With all this traffic
> why can't we get a ride? I know it's all about money. In the latest
> AMSAT Journal there is an article talking about using frequencies at 5650
> and 3400Mhz. Talk about scarr ing away curr e n t members let alone
> attracting new ones. AO-40 (sobsob) was supposed to be the best of the best
> for everyone. The current mentality seems to be to put all our "over the
> top" technology in one basket. I subscribe to the KISS (keep it simple
> stupid) principle regarding my ham radio endeavors. An example, when L or S
> mode is open on AO-51 how many are there? Yes, I pay my dues, buy AMSAT
> shirts, and contribute to the Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found
> on many of our satellites. I build and sell antennas and send a portion of
> those proceeds to AMSAT. I believe I have earned the right to complain. I
> have read the background of many of our members and BOD, we indeed have
> many very smart educated people in high places. Am I naive about the
> details? No doubt. I'm just a retired old ham with a back yard full of
> unuseable antennas, and a lack of comprehenson about what is going on (or
> not). If this diatribe is all wet I can take the slings and arrows. Talk
> to me about it on AO-7.
>
>
>
> 73 Bob W7LRD
>
> AMSAT 28498
>
> Seattle
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 22:44:14 -0800
From: "Art McBride" <kc6uqh@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: "'Rocky Jones'" <orbitjet@xxxxxxx.xxx>, <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>,
"'Amsat BB'" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <680D42234EB14F988DA849A1692BF596@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Rocky,
The biggest doubt is how do we get it up there? If anyone offers us a low
cost ride we need to say: Thank You and Yes Sir!
Amateur radio operators are .02 % of the US population. Boy do we have
influence!
I won't be warming up my soldering iron until I see something ready to ride
with a launch agreement.
Art, KC6UQH
_____
From: Rocky Jones [mailto:orbitjet@xxxxxxx.xxxx
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 10:30 PM
To: kc6uqh@xxx.xxxx w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxxx Amsat BB
Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
Art...no doubt...but the big question is...how much gear is going to be
available to "the average ham" that works on 3.3 adn 5.6 ghz...and on what
modes and at what price.
the presentation in the recent Journal seems to recycle a phrase "the
audacity of hope"
Robert WB5MZO Life member
> From: kc6uqh@xxx.xxx
> To: w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxxx AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 22:17:25 -0800
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
>
> Bob,
> While I was only on the fringe of some of the discussions about being a
> piggy back on a Geo sat would require the use of those frequencies to be
> compatible with the main operation of the communications sat and antenna
> system.
>
> Art, KC6UQH
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
> Behalf Of w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx
> Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 12:41 PM
> To: AMSAT-bb@xxxxx.xxx
> Subject: [amsat-bb] HEO naivete
>
>
>
> Hello
>
> I have never complained on this BB before. However, I do have a fair
> amount of naivete (as many of us) regarding our next HEO. The lack of
> information from AMSAT as well from our DL friends is frustraiting. I
read
> in the news about many countries sending up satellites virtually every
few
> weeks. . The shuttle is going up every few months. With all this
traffic
> why can't we get a ride? I know it's all about money. In the latest
> AMSAT Journal there is an article talking about using frequencies at 5650
> and 3400Mhz. Talk about scarr ing away curr e n t members let alone
> attracting new ones. AO-40 (sobsob) was supposed to be the best of the
best
> for everyone. The current mentality seems to be to put all our "over the
> top" technology in one basket. I subscribe to the KISS (keep it simple
> stupid) principle regarding my ham radio endeavors. An example, when L or
S
> mode is open on AO-51 how many are there? Yes, I pay my dues, buy AMSAT
> shirts, and contribute to the Presidents Club fu nding, and can be found
> on many of our satellites. I build and sell antennas and send a portion
of
> those proceeds to AMSAT. I believe I have earned the right to complain.
I
> have read the background of many of our members and BOD, we indeed have
> many very smart educated people in high places. Am I naive about the
> details? No doubt. I'm just a retired old ham with a back yard full of
> unuseable antennas, and a lack of comprehenson about what is going on (or
> not). If this diatribe is all wet I can take the slings and arrows. Talk
> to me about it on AO-7.
>
>
>
> 73 Bob W7LRD
>
> AMSAT 28498
>
> Seattle
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
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>
>
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> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 22:29:03 -0900
From: Edward Cole <kl7uw@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: Amsat BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <200902070729.n177T30G009264@xxxxxx.xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 04:28 PM 2/6/2009, Rocky Jones wrote:
>Bob...Your "rant" strikes me as pretty close to right on the
>money. I read the missive in the latest journal about 3.3 and 5.6
>ghz links and thought "thats nice, It will never happen".
>
>A baseline requrement for ANY Amateur satellites should be that
>they work on frequencies and modulation methods which are consistent
>with radios that are already commercially manufactured for the bands
>in question...or can use some very easily (think the MDS converters)
>commercial gear for other services.
>
>The instant the "bird" is designed with some type of radio in mind
>that does not exist now and is limited to that bird...then the
>entire adventure is nice but has little practical value.
>
>Why on earth is the AMSAT community wasting time on a design which
>requires a ground station that is (by the latest Amsat Journal)
>"beyond the scope of most hams". Instead of spending time working
>on making an 'acp capable earth station within the reach of most
>radio amateurs".
>
>Because if the equipment has little value beyond a satellite which
>could do an Oscar 40 at any time how many are going to shell out the money?
>
>I dont have a clue why the AMSAT design folks seem to think that it
>isnecessary to drive up into the microwave frequencies. They never
>seem to answer the question why a 2meter 70cm translator is not a
>good solution...and the one that we really need.
>
>Meanwhile AO-7 flies on.
>
>Robert WB5MZO life member
Well, there are a few reasons:
1- 2m & 70cm antennas are large and it takes a large satellite to support them
2- Microwave antennas are physically smaller and yet will provide more gain
3- Microwave frequencies are quieter (low sky noise) so they work
better with low noise receivers; some mw freqs. are less impacted by
interference and/or pirate stations.
When such a mw satellite can be launched, many sources of equipment
will surface. Downeast Microwave and Kuhne Electronics will come out
with equipment when there is a market for them.
73, Ed - KL7UW
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 17:09:00 -0500
From: Jeff Davis <ke9vee@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: HEO naivete
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<76d6fe480902061409r1e72049cu1989bc98d76d780e@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 4:39 PM, Bruce Robertson <ve9qrp@xxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
> I know the following is something some of us do not want to hear, but
> this new economic reality also has presented us (and others) with some
> interesting opportunities in LEO.
Bingo.
Ours is no longer a launch/cost problem -- paying for a ride to HEO is
just out of the question.
Our real problem is facing the reality that radio amateurs may never
have another opportunity for HEO. I have previously (and frequently to
no avail) written that we are __long__ past the time when we should
still be crying in our beer over HEO.
We need to let that go and follow a new path. And as Bruce pointed out
so well, there are multiplied opportunities that are actually very
feasible at LEO. We should be developing scientific payloads that use
amateur radio to downlink and share data with a global audience. There
is so much to explore with global climate change and other similar
areas that are interesting and in high demand -- and it would garner
us no end of publicity and new members.
Instead, many continue to cry for nothing but HEO. Having been an
active AO-13 operator I really understand that desire; heck, I would
also like to believe in Santa Claus but it ain't happening. If you
factor AO-40 out of the equation, AMSAT last placed a bird in HEO in
1988. That was 21 years ago -- how many decades are we going to keep
hoping for a magic ride to HEO before we accept reality and move on?
The longer we wait, and spin our wheels hoping for a miracle, the more
this all becomes a moot point. If all the action is going to be at
LEO, and AMSAT is firmly determined not to plan for a LEO future, then
AMSAT becomes more irrelevant with each passing year until it is no
more.
73, Jeff KE9V
AMSAT-NA
AMSAT-DL
------------------------------
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End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 4, Issue 59
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