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CX2SA > SATDIG 28.12.08 05:17l 1076 Lines 35291 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Elk Antenna vs Arrow Antenna (Trey Brown) (Mike Ryan)
2. Re: Elk Antenna vs Arrow Antenna (Trey Brown) (n3tl@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx
3. KC0TOH (Andrew Glasbrenner)
4. Re: KC0TOH (Sebastian)
5. FT 847/SYMEK F-IFD installed and TNC3S on EBAY
(wgravett@xxxx.xxxx
6. Portable Satellite LOTW (Gary "Joe" Mayfield)
7. ELK or ARROW (Jim Danehy)
8. Re: Portable Satellite LOTW (Rafael Valdez G.)
9. ANS-363 AMSAT Weekly Bulletins (Lee McLamb)
10. Delfi C3 status? (John Marranca, Jr)
11. Fw: ELK or ARROW (Jim Danehy)
12. Re: Fw: ELK or ARROW (Art McBride)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:12:21 -0500
From: "Mike Ryan" <mryan301@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Elk Antenna vs Arrow Antenna (Trey Brown)
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <3DD9BA9ED1334353B52C9F5091D3E70C@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I have both. I started with the ELK due to the cheaper price as it does
dual
band without a duplexer. I've been very happy with it and its currently in
my
back yard on a rotor (its cold outside this time of year). For comparison,
I
bought the Arrow 5 months ago. Contrary to N3TL'd very respetable and
valued
comments, the Arrow does seem to do better for me, holding a signal a
little
lower in the sky. No leaps and bounds, but noticeable.
I'd sum it up like this:
Elk
+ cheaper all around
+ can be easily set up for permanent use
+ easier to aim due to wider beam width. Log periodic are like this.
+ smaller and very fast setup/teardown
+ one connector for dual band.
- no handle for handheld use . You have to make one, but it's extremely
easy
to do. And no threads for tripod.
- inconvenient if using 2 rigs. Must but a separate duplexer.
Arrow
+ copies a few degrees (just a few) lower than the Elk at my QTH
+ convenient built in handle and built in threads for tripod
- narrower beam width - have to "aim" better.
- not easily set up for permanent use. No simple mount and you wouldn't
want
to leave that "in handle" duplexer outside
- Can easily use for 2 rigs. Just don't use the duplexer (if so equipped)
and
plug into the separate UHF and VHF
Mike WB1AAT
-------------- Original message from "Trey Brown" <palintheus@xxxxx.xxx>:
----
----------
> I'm looking to get started in FM satellites and am considering
> purchasing one of these antennas. Wanting to get some thoughts and
> opinions from people that have been doing this longer than I have
> been.
>
> http://www.elkantennas.com/2m4405element.htm
> http://arrowantennas.com/146-437.html
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:30:15 +0000
From: n3tl@xxxxxxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Elk Antenna vs Arrow Antenna (Trey Brown)
To: Mike Ryan <mryan301@xxxxxxx.xxx>, <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: Mike Ryan <mryan301@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<122720082030.25484.49569057000617F70000638C22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C
04040A0DBF049BCC02@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain
Mike,
Great points all - especially those about the relative performance of the
two
antennas at your QTH. I believe that's an important element of the
equation.
It would be really nice for anyone considering the purchase to have a
chance
to compare side-by-side at their location(s) with their gear.
The bottom line is what works best for you, the end owner of the product
in
question. Both antennas work. The ultimate purchase decision ought to be
an
individual one that's based on which product (radio, antenna, accessory,
etc.)
works best for the person who's about to spend the money.
73 to all,
Tim
-------------- Original message from "Mike Ryan" <mryan301@xxxxxxx.xxx>:
-----
---------
I have both. I started with the ELK due to the cheaper price as it does
dual
band without a duplexer. I've been very happy with it and its currently in
my
back yard on a rotor (its cold outside this time of year). For comparison,
I
bought the Arrow 5 months ago. Contrary to N3TL'd very respetable and
valued
comments, the Arrow does seem to do better for me, holding a signal a
little
> lower in the sky. No leaps and bounds, but noticeable.
>
> I'd sum it up like this:
>
> Elk
> + cheaper all around
> + can be easily set up for permanent use
> + easier to aim due to wider beam width. Log periodic are like this.
> + smaller and very fast setup/teardown
> + one connector for dual band. - no handle for handheld use . You have to
make one, but it's extremely easy to
> do. And no threads for tripod.
> - inconvenient if using 2 rigs. Must but a separate duplexer.
>
> Arrow
> + copies a few degrees (just a few) lower than the Elk at my QTH
> + convenient built in handle and built in threads for tripod
> - narrower beam width - have to "aim" better.
> - not easily set up for permanent use. No simple mount and you wouldn't want
to
> leave that "in handle" duplexer outside
> - Can easily use for 2 rigs. Just don't use the duplexer (if so equipped)
and
> plug into the separate UHF and VHF
>
> Mike WB1AAT
>
> -------------- Original message from "Trey Brown" :
> --------------
>
>
> > I'm looking to get started in FM satellites and am considering
> > purchasing one of these antennas. Wanting to get some thoughts and
> > opinions from people that have been doing this longer than I have
> > been.
> >
> > http://www.elkantennas.com/2m4405element.htm
> > http://arrowantennas.com/146-437.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:45:36 -0500
From: "Andrew Glasbrenner" <glasbrenner@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] KC0TOH
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <2DFCB246F5D44D49B60C742ECBD69A5A@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Are you on this list, or does someone have a working email for him?
73, Drew KO4MA
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:50:08 -0500
From: Sebastian <w4as@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: KC0TOH
To: AMSAT BB <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <2221B296-0284-4876-8D10-93DD33994307@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
He's on the satellites, but without any ears as you know. Thanks for
bring up AO-16 yet again, and hope you are enjoying the holidays.
73 de W4AS
Sebastian
On Dec 27, 2008, at 3:45 PM, Andrew Glasbrenner wrote:
> Are you on this list, or does someone have a working email for him?
>
> 73, Drew KO4MA
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 18:13:00 GMT
From: "wgravett@xxxx.xxxx <wgravett@xxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] FT 847/SYMEK F-IFD installed and TNC3S on EBAY
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <20081227.181300.13221.0@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Hi HAM Satellite enthusiasts
Mark it on your calendar!. On Jan 5th, 9:00pm PST, I am listing the above
mentioned equipment with a low reserve on ebay.
The SYMEK TNC3S is equipped with a 9.6k and a 38.4k modem. The FT-847 is
maxed
out with a voice synthesizer, 500hz cw filter, and 2.5khz SSB filters .
You
can process satellite pictures with this set-up.
If you want a terrific deal or know some one who wants to get into
satellite
communication in a first class way, here is the opportunity.
I will be selling some more ham satellite stuff on ebay and will keep you
informed when it goes on the block.
Best 73 and a Happy '09.
Bill, W5PGZ
____________________________________________________________
Click here for free information on how to reduce your debt by filing for
bankruptcy.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/PnY6rw22U6CbwaM6XKTobQu85BjbJ9s
tO1
hPhjKyOAy8Oetp7VClP/
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:29:11 -0600
From: "Gary \"Joe\" Mayfield" <gary_mayfield@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Portable Satellite LOTW
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <COL0-DAV465ADE4CC484766D2BA3AA8AE80@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Has anyone mastered putting records of portable satellite operations into
Log Book of The World? I would like to give folks credit for the Grids I
worked them from, but how to do this is not obvious.
73,
Joe kk0sd
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 17:06:39 -0500
From: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <F8214E543B1247EEA482D76EAE56C8AD@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent Britain, WA5VJB
http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf
he says that some have measured the Arrow for gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi
(isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis showed that for the element
lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz . . .
Kent is
a well respected VHF/UHF antenna person who has plenty of credibility . .
.
Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not have its elements insulated
from
the boom. It uses dimensions for insulated elements . . . so much for the
Arrow . . . .
Now for the ELK : a local friend of mine owns an Arrow and he uses it
successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted to compare the Arrow and the
ELK
. . . . he could not make an across town QSO on 435 mhz from his second
story
window with the ELK , so he sent the ELK back for a refund .
I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several hundred satellite users . .
.the
majority of the folks that have worked and QSLed me (close to 250 + ) have
been using either the Arrow or ELK based upon the information on their
cards.
So they are popular. Are they optimum ? A lot of anecdotal information
would
seem to say NO . . .
Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a homebrew 2 mtr yagi that
probably was worse than either the Arrow or Elk but I worked YV and KL7
from
Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the 3 elements which my XYL waved
around
at my directions . . . not any more . . .what do I use these days : a pair
of
circular polarity yagis on 10 foot booms manufactured by M Square . . . .
Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford or maybe a Chevy . . .
neither
is a Cadillac . . . .
Jim W9VNE
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 16:10:08 -0700
From: "Rafael Valdez G." <rafavaldez@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Portable Satellite LOTW
To: <gary_mayfield@xxxxxxx.xxx>, <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <BAY111-W4DFD5DE4CC0D3FD6E1D7DDBE80@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi Joe,
you just have to make different locations in your signatures, in those
locations you will be specific of the state and gridsquare of your
operation..
your call will remain the same...
73's and happy hollidays...
Rafael Valdez Jr.
XE2RV @ DL55
10-10 52716
VUCC Sat #164
http://sat-xe.blogspot.com
EX-XE2PWF
P Before printing, please think about your responsibility and commitment
with
the ENVIRONMENT.
Antes de Imprimir, piensa entu responsabilidad y compromiso con el MEDIO
AMBIENTE
> From: gary_mayfield@xxxxxxx.xxx> To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx> Date: Sat, 27 Dec
2008 15:29:11 -0600> Subject: [amsat-bb] Portable Satellite LOTW> > Has
anyone
mastered putting records of portable satellite operations into> Log Book
of
The World? I would like to give folks credit for the Grids I> worked them
from, but how to do this is not obvious.> > > > 73,> > Joe kk0sd> >
_______________________________________________> Sent via
AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx.
Opinions expressed are those of the author.> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join
now
to support the amateur satellite program!> Subscription settings:
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:23:38 -0500
From: Lee McLamb <ku4os@xxx.xx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ANS-363 AMSAT Weekly Bulletins
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<20081228012340.IVXA7108.cdptpa-omta01.mail.rr.com@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
AMSAT NEWS SERVICE
ANS-363
ANS is a free, weekly, news and information service of AMSAT North
America,
The
Radio Amateur Satellite Corporation. ANS reports on the activities of a
worldwide group of Amateur Radio operators who share an active interest in
designing, building, launching and communicating through analog and
digital
Amateur Radio satellites.
Please send any amateur satellite news or reports to:
ans-editor@xxxxx.xxx
In this edition:
* SKN on OSCAR 2009 This Week
* AO-51 Schedule to Support SKN and Kids Day
* Richard Garriott Interview Available Online
* ARISS 25th Commemorative Event to Feature L/V Repeater This Week
* ARISS Status - 22 December 2008
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-363.01
SKN on OSCAR 2009 This Week
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 363.01
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
December 28, 2008
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-363.01
Ray Soifer, W2RS extends the annual cordial invitation to all radio
amateurs worldwide to participate in AMSAT's Straight Key Night (SKN)
on OSCAR 2009.
Participating in SKN on OSCAR 2009 is easy. No rules, no scoring and
no need to send in a log. Just operate CW through any OSCAR between
0000 and 2400 UTC on 1 January 2009, using a straight hand key.
In keeping with the friendly nature of this event, all participants
are encouraged to nominate someone they worked for "Best Fist." Your
nominee need not have the best fist of those you heard, just of those
you worked. Please send your nomination to w2rs@xxxxx.xxx. A list of
those nominated will appear in ANS and The AMSAT Journal.
CU SKN!
[ANS thanks Ray Soifer, W2RS for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-363.02
AO-51 Schedule to Support SKN and Kids Day
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 363.02
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
December 28, 2008
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-363.02
AMSAT VP of Operations, Drew Glasbrenner, KO4MA, reminds everyone
that AO-51 will
be configured to support two upcoming special events. For the first time
AO-
51
will be configured to support CW operations during the annual SKN Event.
Following SKN the uplink will be reconfigured back to the more
traditional FM/FM
up and downlinks to support the ARRL's Kids Day event.
December 29 - January 2
FM Repeater, V/U
Uplink: 145.920 MHz FM
Downlink: 435.300 MHz FM
SSB/FM Repeater, V/U (CW QSOs only on Straight Key Night)
Uplink: 145.880 MHz USB
Downlink: 435.150 MHz FM
January 3
FM Repeater, V/U
Uplink: 145.920 MHz FM
Downlink: 435.300 MHz FM
FM Repeater, V/U (ARRL Kid's Day, QSOs between or with kids ONLY)
Uplink: 145.880 MHz FM
Downlink: 435.150 MHz FM
[ANS thanks Drew, KO4MA, for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-363.03
Richard Garriott Interview Available Online
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 363.03
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
December 28, 2008
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-363.03
Space traveler Richard Garriott, W5KWQ, ha been interviewed by science
fiction writer Tracy Hickman about Garriott's recent visit to the
International Space Station. During the session, W5KWQ talked about his
experience of operating amateur radio on orbit and conversing with the ham
community worldwide.
The entire interview is 2 hours and 45 minutes in duration. Its available
in 3 installments. You will find it at
http://feeds.feedburner.com/Dragonhearth
[ANS thanks Newsline for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-363.04
ARISS 25th Commemorative Event to Feature L/V Repeater This Week
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 363.04
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
December 28, 2008
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-363.04
To date, the ISS crew has configured the radio to support cross-band
repeater
operations, they have supported some SSTV downlinks and we have had the
opportunity to participate in a special test of 9600 baud packet
radio operations
on the simplex frequency of 145.825 MHz.
Specifically, December 28-January 3, we plan to reconfigure the Crossband
repeater for a special experiment. This will be a test of our L-Band
uplink
capability, which, to date, has not been proven out. Plan for an uplink of
1269.65 MHz and and downlink on the standard frequency 145.80 MHz using
low
power. Given the substantial cable losses of the L-band system, we
hope some "big
guns" are able to penetrate through, keep up with doppler, and make the
connection.
We will provide more updates in the near future. We would like to remind
everyone that ISS flight requirements related to EVA and vehicle activity
may
require the radio to be off for some portion of this schedule. And school
contacts and general QSO opportunities by the crew will also preempt this
schedule for short periods of time. (But remember that if you hear these,
you
still qualify for a commemorative certificate).
Frank concluded, "In the meantime, enjoy the ARISS ops on ISS! And
congratulations to Owen Garriott, W5LFL, on the 25th anniversary of
his historic
flight!!"
[ANS thanks Frank, KA3HDO, AMSAT-NA V.P. for Human Spaceflight Programs
and ARISS International Chairman for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-363.05
ARISS Status - 22 December 2008
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 363.05
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
December 28, 2008
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-363.05
1. Upcoming School Contacts
An Amateur Radio on the International Space Station (ARISS) contact has
been
scheduled with Technopolis in Mechelen, Belgium on Monday, December 29 at
11:43
UTC via telebridge station WH6PN in Hawaii. The mission of Technopolis is
to
bring science and technology to the public. The center has permanent and
temporary exhibits and organizes workshops, school activities and
other outreach
activities. The ARISS contact will be open to all school children 6
-18 years of
age and will be supported through a workshop, lecture or science show.
2. Canadian School Contact Successful
Students from King George Elementary School in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan,
Canada
took part in a question and answer session with Sandra Magnus, KE5FYE. The
Amateur Radio on the International Space Station (ARISS) contact took
place on
Monday, December 15. Ten students were able to ask one question each of
the
astronaut as an audience of 320 looked on. Ray Boughen, Minister of
Education
Provincial Parliament, Dale McBain, City of Moose Jaw Mayor (both former
educators) and Brenda Edwards, Director of Education for Prairie South
School
Division attended. Television stations taped the event and interviewed the
children. Radio station CHAB interviewed the school
coordinator. The Moose Jaw
Times Herald printed an article covering the contact. See:
http://www.mjtimes.sk.ca/index.cfm?sid=201052&sc=3
The story includes links to the contact video:
http://www.mjtimes.sk.ca/index.cfm?main=broadcast&bcid=10109
Principal Ward Milligan commented, "It was an awesome 'once in a lifetime
experience' that will become more important in the lives of these students
as
they look back upon this event in years to come. Having a personal
contact with
someone in space increased the students' interest in space by three fold.
Sandra Magnus was very enthusiastic and answered the students' questions
in a
manner they could relate to. She was very encouraging of the students.
It
was
an inspirational and moving experience."
3. Italian Students Radio ISS
On Thursday, December 18, students from Scuola Elementare Faleriense
"Gianni
Rodari" in Porto Sant'Elpidio, Italy participated in an Amateur Radio on
the
International Space Station (ARISS) contact with Mike Fincke, KE5AIT as
over
three hundred students, teachers and parents gathered for the event.
Twenty-
one
students questioned the astronaut and Season's Greetings were exchanged.
RAI3
Regional Television and some local media and newspapers covered the event.
The
audio was fed into the EchoLink servers. For more information, including
photos
and audio, go to: www.ariss-eu.org/2008_12_18.htm
The Corriere News ran an article (in Italian):
http://www.corrierenews.it/index.php/corrierenews3100/content/view/full/220
25
ESA mentions the recent Marco Polo, Circolo Didattico San Giuseppe and
Gianni
Rodari contacts in this story (also in Italian):
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMXK4TTGOF_Italy_2.html
4. ARISS International Meeting Held
The Amateur Radio on the International Space Station (ARISS) team meeting
was
held on Tuesday, December 16. Agenda items included the next face-to-face
meeting, SuitSat-2 development status and the ARISS special event. Minutes
have
been posted to the ARISS Web site. See:
http://www.rac.ca/ariss/arisstel2008-12-16.htm
5. Astronaut Training Status
Astronaut Michael Barratt, KD5MIJ, took a refresher course on the Amateur
Radio
on the International Space Station (ARISS) equipment and operations on
Wednesday, December 17. Barratt is looking forward to supporting the
program
during his time on board the ISS as an Expedition 19 crew member.
Expedition
19
is the first half of the planned 6 person crew.
6. ARRL QST Covers ARISS News
The American Radio Relay League (ARRL) printed 4 Amateur Radio on the
International Space Station (ARISS) news items in its January 2009
issue of QST.
Under "Media Hits" (page 12) is a lengthy paragraph about how the
media coverage
for Richard Garriott, W5KWQ, was very prolific.
A story on pages 59-60 is about Andrea Hartlage, KG4IUM, a student at
Georgia
Tech who's a ham and was quite interested in ARISS. She was friends with a
ham
teacher at a middle school near her middle school; the teacher had applied
for
an ARISS contact. The story is called "DXpedition to Planet Mars" and is
about
Andrea's involvement in the Mars Desert Research Station (MDRS). It
says at the
end that she wants to be an astronaut.
Two columns under "Happenings" (page 63) are titled "Richard Garriott;
W5KWQ
Back on Terra Firma" which is about Richard and ARISS. It carries two
pictures
- one of the students in Austin who contacted him during his mission in
space
and the other is a photo of Richard.
"Grants Focus on the Future of Amateur Radio" (page 95) covers three
groups that
won ARRL Foundation grants. One grant was given to the Eagle Scouts of
Indiana
who took part in an ARISS contact at the Space Jamboree 2008. The
grant received
was used to fund equipment for electronic building projects at the Space
Jamboree which helped scouts complete the electronics merit badge.
The equipment
also served other regional and national scout gatherings to introduce
amateur
radio. Another group that received an award was the Ann Arbor Hands-On
Museum
which is scheduled for an ARISS contact on December 27. The money received
funded a ham station (and antenna) in the museum lobby.
7. ARRL and AMSAT Articles on ARISS Special Event
The American Radio Relay League (ARRL) ran a Web story about the 25th
anniversary of ham radio in space. It includes the latest news covering
the
Amateur Radio on the International Space Station (ARISS) special event.
See:
http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2008/12/18/10509/?nc=1
The ARRL also issued a W1AW bulletin on the same subject and an article
was
published in the ARRL Letter. See: http://www.arrl.org/arrlletter/08/1219/
[ANS thanks Carol, KB3LKI, for the above information]
In addition to regular membership, AMSAT offers membership in the
President's
Club. Members of the President's Club, as sustaining donors to AMSAT
Project
Funds, will be eligible to receive additional benefits. Application forms
are
available from the AMSAT Office.
73,
This week's ANS Editor,
Lee McLamb, KU4OS
ku4os at amsat dot org
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:49:21 -0500
From: "John Marranca, Jr" <KB2HSH@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Delfi C3 status?
To: amsat-bb <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<8edcdb130812271749v188f65d9o4b77711457b6f9fd@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Happy Holidays, Everyone. I hope Santa was good to everyone this year.
Is Delfi C3 non-operational at this time? Each time I monitor passes, I
hear no activity. I was under the impression that it was SUPPOSED to be
open for Amateur use.
Also, Delfi's Operation's web page doesn't appear to have been updated
since
November.
Did I miss something?
73 de John KB2HSH
--
_______________________________
John Marranca, Jr
PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122
BN Systems, Inc
Orchard Park, NY
(716)972-2006
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 21:33:29 -0500
From: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Fw: ELK or ARROW
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <6A5086715BB9497CBE3B8BDB3B7ECC42@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=response
. there is the old adage that you get what you pay for . . . why buy a
poorly designed antenna that does not work very well
> ?
>
> If you have a 5 element yagi that only produces 4 dbi you are not getting
> what you paid for . . . most 2 element yagis would out perform that
> statistic . . . a 5 element yagi should be at least 9 db + or 10 db dbd
> (dipole ) not isotropic . . . . there is something that is called
> MERCHANTABILITY . . .i.e., an IMPLIED WARRANTY that you are getting at
> least the minimum for your money . . .
> 4 dbi for an Arrow is way off base . . . so it is not just ; you can not
> afford a Cadillac but you are not even getting a Ford or Chevy . . i.e.,
> the gain of a 5 element yagi on 435 mhz . . . that is the issue, not cost
> alone . . . . . . same comments apply to the ELK but I have attempted to
> make the point that there is a minimum performance for a certain number of
> elements that is pretty OBJECTIVE and when it is not met . . . . well
> that is my point . . . these two antennas have shown to some testers that
> they do not measure up to the minimum EXPECTATIONS . . .unfortunately that
> is acceptable to some . . . . then it becomes acceptable to many . . .
> and objectivity is abandoned . . .
>
> Jim W9VNE
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Trey Brown" <palintheus@xxxxx.xxx>
> To: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx>
> Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW
>
>
>> Thanks for the comments. Realize, though, that not everyone wants or
>> can afford to have the Cadillac.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Jim Danehy <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote:
>>> the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent Britain, WA5VJB
>>>
>>> http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf
>>>
>>> he says that some have measured the Arrow for gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi
>>> (isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis showed that for the
>>> element lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz
>>> . . . Kent is a well respected VHF/UHF antenna person who has plenty of
>>> credibility . . .
>>>
>>> Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not have its elements
>>> insulated from the boom. It uses dimensions for insulated elements . . .
>>> so much for the Arrow . . . .
>>>
>>> Now for the ELK : a local friend of mine owns an Arrow and he uses it
>>> successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted to compare the Arrow and
>>> the ELK . . . . he could not make an across town QSO on 435 mhz from his
>>> second story window with the ELK , so he sent the ELK back for a refund
>>> .
>>>
>>> I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several hundred satellite users .
>>> . .the majority of the folks that have worked and QSLed me (close to 250
>>> + ) have been using either the Arrow or ELK based upon the information
>>> on their cards. So they are popular. Are they optimum ? A lot of
>>> anecdotal information would seem to say NO . . .
>>>
>>> Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a homebrew 2 mtr yagi that
>>> probably was worse than either the Arrow or Elk but I worked YV and KL7
>>> from Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the 3 elements which my XYL
>>> waved around at my directions . . . not any more . . .what do I use
>>> these days : a pair of circular polarity yagis on 10 foot booms
>>> manufactured by M Square . . . .
>>>
>>> Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford or maybe a Chevy . . .
>>> neither is a Cadillac . . . .
>>>
>>> Jim W9VNE
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>> program!
>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Trey -- N5THX
>>
>> They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
>> safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
>> - Benjamin Franklin
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 18:59:10 -0800
From: "Art McBride" <kc6uqh@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Fw: ELK or ARROW
To: "'Jim Danehy'" <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx>, <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <A967FDB553D041C9A1209B51DCC136C9@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To All,
1. Amateur Radio is learning by doing.
2. A large amount of data on Yagi type antennas exists, easily found, and
is
well proven.
3. Several design programs for antennas exist reducing construction time
and
waist of materials.
4. Equipment to measure comparative antenna performance at VHF/UHF
frequencies is not hard to find.
Why do we line the pockets of some poorly designed antenna manufacturing
companies instead of learning how and making the best performing antennas
for our own use? If we do not learn these skills, no one will be left to
teach and the skills will be lost.
There are many older Amateurs willing to teach those that want to learn,
and
hopefully many of those wanting to learn are at least one half of the age
of
those who can teach!
Art,
KC6UQH
-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
Behalf Of Jim Danehy
Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:33 PM
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Fw: ELK or ARROW
. there is the old adage that you get what you pay for . . . why buy a
poorly designed antenna that does not work very well
> ?
>
> If you have a 5 element yagi that only produces 4 dbi you are not getting
> what you paid for . . . most 2 element yagis would out perform that
> statistic . . . a 5 element yagi should be at least 9 db + or 10 db dbd
> (dipole ) not isotropic . . . . there is something that is called
> MERCHANTABILITY . . .i.e., an IMPLIED WARRANTY that you are getting at
> least the minimum for your money . . .
> 4 dbi for an Arrow is way off base . . . so it is not just ; you can not
> afford a Cadillac but you are not even getting a Ford or Chevy . . i.e.,
> the gain of a 5 element yagi on 435 mhz . . . that is the issue, not cost
> alone . . . . . . same comments apply to the ELK but I have attempted to
> make the point that there is a minimum performance for a certain number of
> elements that is pretty OBJECTIVE and when it is not met . . . . well
> that is my point . . . these two antennas have shown to some testers that
> they do not measure up to the minimum EXPECTATIONS . . .unfortunately that
> is acceptable to some . . . . then it becomes acceptable to many . . .
> and objectivity is abandoned . . .
>
> Jim W9VNE
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Trey Brown" <palintheus@xxxxx.xxx>
> To: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx>
> Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW
>
>
>> Thanks for the comments. Realize, though, that not everyone wants or
>> can afford to have the Cadillac.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Jim Danehy <jdanehy@xxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote:
>>> the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent Britain, WA5VJB
>>>
>>> http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf
>>>
>>> he says that some have measured the Arrow for gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi
>>> (isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis showed that for the
>>> element lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz
>>> . . . Kent is a well respected VHF/UHF antenna person who has plenty of
>>> credibility . . .
>>>
>>> Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not have its elements
>>> insulated from the boom. It uses dimensions for insulated elements . . .
>>> so much for the Arrow . . . .
>>>
>>> Now for the ELK : a local friend of mine owns an Arrow and he uses it
>>> successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted to compare the Arrow and
>>> the ELK . . . . he could not make an across town QSO on 435 mhz from his
>>> second story window with the ELK , so he sent the ELK back for a refund
>>> .
>>>
>>> I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several hundred satellite users .
>>> . .the majority of the folks that have worked and QSLed me (close to 250
>>> + ) have been using either the Arrow or ELK based upon the information
>>> on their cards. So they are popular. Are they optimum ? A lot of
>>> anecdotal information would seem to say NO . . .
>>>
>>> Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a homebrew 2 mtr yagi that
>>> probably was worse than either the Arrow or Elk but I worked YV and KL7
>>> from Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the 3 elements which my XYL
>>> waved around at my directions . . . not any more . . .what do I use
>>> these days : a pair of circular polarity yagis on 10 foot booms
>>> manufactured by M Square . . . .
>>>
>>> Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford or maybe a Chevy . . .
>>> neither is a Cadillac . . . .
>>>
>>> Jim W9VNE
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>> program!
>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Trey -- N5THX
>>
>> They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
>> safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
>> - Benjamin Franklin
>>
>
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 3, Issue 673
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