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CX2SA > SATDIG 12.11.13 23:10l 1322 Lines 43590 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: D STAR (Gregg Wonderly)
2. Re: D STAR is here to stay (Gordon JC Pearce)
3. Re: D STAR (PE1RDW)
4. Minotaur-1 mass CubeSat launch November 19 (M5AKA)
5. Re: D STAR (Angelo Glorioso)
6. H.E.O. (Burns Fisher)
7. Re: D STAR (Rob)
8. Re: D STAR (STeve Andre')
9. Re: D STAR (Angelo Glorioso)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 13:59:45 -0600
From: Gregg Wonderly <w5ggw@xxx.xxx>
To: Gordon JC Pearce <gordonjcp@xxxx.xxx>, amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID: <528288B1.1070603@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
What is most important to consider is that there is only one choice, because
of
the investment and low return there is because HAM radio operators don't
want to
spend money. Yet, we buy antennas (isn't there only one source for patented
antenna designs that we flock to?), coax, power systems and lots of other
things
which are largely single sourced by manufacturers that do a great job
creating a
valuable product.
Ultimately, that is the decision to make. Is the money for the product the
right value to pay? If you really believe you can't get a chip, I think you
are
mistaken. Can you get the cheap price in single quantities? No. But, they
are
available last I had heard.
At this point, we are moving into the world of "software" components. These
are
things such as micro-controllers, DSPs and Codecs which are all put together
to
create a useful RF based device.
In the end, SDR is what we actually need to be focused on. That would allow
everyone to "write their own radio" and expand our capabilities with
"digitial"
emissions well beyond where we are at now.
The future is automatic frequency selection, varied modulation techniques
combined with embedded FEC to create an instantaneous solution to interference
problems.
Gregg Wonderly
W5GGW
On 11/11/2013 9:22 AM, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
>> Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same
>> thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it
>> is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun,
>> there is something for everyone
>> 73,s Damon
>
> But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one
> manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to
> a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
>
> It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec
> from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
>
> --
> Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 20:24:07 +0000
From: Gordon JC Pearce <gordonjcp@xxxx.xxx>
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR is here to stay
Message-ID: <20131112202407.GB23028@xxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 06:57:39PM +0000, wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxx wrote:
> I would like to see the DSTAR users pick a REFLECTOR and use it as a
state side intercomm. How cool would that be? Some one asking the group ,
hey who was that in fm-- or CN--or what was the call of the guy in DN--.
Look at how we could all help each other while working the birds.
Why not just use your phone? Far more reliable, far better coverage, far
better battery life and a tiny fraction of the cost...
--
Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 21:20:11 +0100
From: PE1RDW <sats@xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx>
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID: <52828D7B.9050008@xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
On 12-11-13 19:38, John Becker wrote:
>
> On 11/12/2013 8:16 AM, aflowers@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote:
>> I think that was Rob's point. There is no opportunity to learn from
>> it let alone improve upon it because the protocol is at the very
>> least a guarded trade secret if not patented
> YES IT IS. And for good reason. Just as well as Motorola Kenwood and
> Yaesu has done the same.
> It's time to get over it.
>
> And GENERAL MOTORS did what with their ON STAR system? Copyright and
> patents. How dare them do that.
>
> John, W0JAB
>
I'm not a fan of D STAR but the protocol is very much open and Hams are
building their own systems, just have a look at things like Dutch STAR.
Yes the codec is close licenced but everyone can buy the IC to decode
and encode it for reasonable prices (between $20 and $30 depending on
source).
There even people developing complete addons to do D STAR without a PC,
just the addon and a 9K6 capable fm transiever.
73 de Andre PE1RDW
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 20:32:35 +0000 (GMT)
From: M5AKA <m5aka@xxxxx.xx.xx>
To: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Minotaur-1 mass CubeSat launch November 19
Message-ID:
<1384288355.74563.YahooMailNeo@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
The launch window for KySat-2 and over a dozen other CubeSats from Wallops
Island opens November 19, see
http://amsat-uk.org/2013/11/12/kysat-2-in-november-cubesat-launch/
Also on the AMSAT-UK site:
Ham Radio Balloon on 7, 10 and 14 MHz
http://amsat-uk.org/2013/11/12/ham-radio-balloon-on-7-10-and-14-mhz/
FUNcube-1 Handbook now in Italian
http://amsat-uk.org/2013/11/12/funcube-1-handbook-now-in-italian/
----
73 Trevor M5AKA
AMSAT-UK website http://amsat-uk.org/
Facebook https://www.facebook.com/pages/AMSAT-UK/208113275898396
Twitter https://twitter.com/AMSAT_UK
----
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 14:42:58 -0600
From: Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP3556E4C60DAB887A86C5B11EDFE0@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=response
Last question. Do you know for a fact that
the AMBE codecs was not developed by
a ham radio operator for that company???
A lot of hams are in that business.
7 3 de Angelo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:16 PM
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>
>
>> An example of an enhancement to the radio art would be PSK31 for example.
>>
>> Created by an amateur radio operator used by amateur radio operators. An
>> amazing technology for weak signal work. Multiple conversations tacking
>> place in a single SSB "channel."
>>
>> Don't misinterpret what I'm saying ... D-STAR is neat .... but if I (or
>> someone smarter than me) can't fabricate it from core technologies it
>> can't
>> be fully understood or improved upon. Which is what this hobby is suppose
>> to be about.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
>>>
>>> PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM
>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>
>>>
>>> I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "To help the believer " :-)
>>>>>
>>>>> Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it
>>>>> in a long time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the
>>>>> radio art!!!!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM
>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "To help the non beleiver.. "
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way
>>>>>> repeaters
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> ... but I digress)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the
>>>>>> radio
>>>>>> art ... it does not promote innovation ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've
>>>>>> learned
>>>>>> nothing and you've given nothing back.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any
>>>>>> value
>>>>>> for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the
>>>>>> highest
>>>>>> bidder.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, <lucleblanc6@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
>>>>>>> > > Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the
>>>>>>> > > same
>>>>>>> > > thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with
>>>>>>> > > DSTAR
>>>>>>> > > it
>>>>>>> > > is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much
>>>>>>> > > fun,
>>>>>>> > > there is something for everyone
>>>>>>> > > 73,s Damon
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig.
>>>>>>> > Only
>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>> manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell
>>>>>>> to a
>>>>>>> handful of approved radio manufacturers.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the
>>>>>>> > AMBE
>>>>>>> codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > --
>>>>>>> > Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the >
>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>> > Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one
>>>>>>> choose
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something
>>>>>>> has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who
>>>>>>> wants
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication
>>>>>>> protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> to say competition is already present.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The cost question.
>>>>>>> You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> 700$
>>>>>>> and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just
>>>>>>> an example and i'm not connected to their business.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters-
>>>>>>> --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1&
>>>>>>> ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+
>>>>>>> you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham
>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>> no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you
>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>> be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the
>>>>>>> internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you
>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>> live on my planet.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just let folks live free...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Luc Leblanc VE2DWE
>>>>>>> WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>> author.
>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>> program!
>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>> author.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>> program!
>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>> program!
>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 15:49:49 -0500
From: Burns Fisher <burns@xxxxxx.xx>
To: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] H.E.O.
Message-ID:
<CABX7KxWbuFdaU7BJpuz8U-j=u_xfNvHVGc9r7pTmUJ3CQ9jdkQ@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hi Keith,
Just so you know, HEO is probably the most contentious issue around (next
to FM vs Linear). I think it is fair to say that EVERYONE would love to
have an HEO bird, but it's hard-to-impossible to find a launch for free or
cheap. As Domenico said, the German AMSAT (AMSAT-DL) has an HEO bird ready
to fly, but they are still looking for launch opportunities, and have been
for a while now. AMSAT-NA is currently focusing on LEO cubesats (and we
already have commitments for two launches). The first launches will be FM
satellites. The future may hold software defined radios which we could
program for any modulation type.
About rotators etc: It depends. Some satellites (generally FM) are
available from some handhelds with just a whip, but that is kind of iffy.
Much better to have a handheld antenna with some gain, which is what I
think Domenico was aluding to. I'm a fan of baby steps. First try to
listen with an HT (handheld). Maybe you can transmit to the satellite,
maybe not, since FM only allows a single user at a time. Then try a
handheld satellite antenna (Eagle for example...look in the AMSAT store).
If you already have a fixed base station, try it with an omni (e.g. an
eggbeater or something). You might spend your money on a pre-amp next
before a rotator.
The short answer probably is that a nice directional antenna on a rotator
with a good preamp is probably best if your goal is to talk via satellite
and get the strongest signal for the longest time. But starting small, you
learn a lot. Using a handheld is kind of cool because you can think to
yourself "I'm pointing this thing at a satellite...there is NOTHING between
me and this cool piece of machinery in space".
BTW, I can say all this, but I have to admit that I have not yet been
terribly successful transmitting. I can receive very well...even SO50 (1/4
watt) comes in reasonably well on my HT with a rubber ducky and no preamp
(when it is high in the sky). But I think I only just managed get into
SO-50 pretty recently. I think my problem is 1) Omni antenna, not beam and
2) Not a terribly good location.
Hope this helps...
73,
Burns, W2BFJ
Message: 10
> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 20:21:12 +0100
> From: "i8cvs" <domenico.i8cvs@xxx.xx>
> To: "Keith Crittenden" <Keithcrittenden@xxxxxx.xxx>, "Amsat - BBs"
> <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: H.E.O.?
> Message-ID: <002801cedfdc$59f12c60$0401a8c0@xxxxxx>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Keith
>
> Only God know if and when a HEO Amateur Satellite will be placed in orbit
> by
> AMSAT.
>
> AMSAT-DL is working around P3E wich is a satellite similar to OSCAR-13
> using all modes from the VHF to Microwave but there are no money sufficient
> to pay for the launch at the moment.
>
> About to work the actual operational satellites the extra expences of
> buying a rotator /elevator is recommended while starting the activity you
> can use a more simple low cost yagi antenna for 2 m and 70 cm manually
> aimed toward the satellite.
>
> 73" de
>
> i8CVS Domenico
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Keith Crittenden" <Keithcrittenden@xxxxxx.xxx>
> To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
> Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 9:43 PM
> Subject: [amsat-bb] H.E.O.?
>
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > Two Questions from a newbie;
> >
> > I'm interested to know if there are any plans to put a H.E.O. amateur
> satellite into orbit in the near future, and if so does anyone have an idea
> as to what mode it would be likely to work in?
> >
> > And, (second question) as I'm in the process of setting up a station
> (pretty much from scratch) for the purpose of working satellites I'm
> wondering if it's considered worth the extra expense of buying a rotator
> /elevator or just a rotator.
> >
> > All knowledgeable opinions would be appreciated.
> >
> > Keith.
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 20:58:04 +0000
From: Rob <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
To: AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID:
<CAE1O4xp3JoiFpdRMeKwNp-RFP-Em6=jiuwk1DpW_0T8yjU+s6w@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
If I can't duplicate the codec .... understand the codec ... improve the
codec ... whether a ham developed it or not is irrelevant.
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 8:42 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
>
> Last question. Do you know for a fact that
> the AMBE codecs was not developed by
> a ham radio operator for that company???
> A lot of hams are in that business.
>
> 7 3 de Angelo
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:16 PM
>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>
>>
>> An example of an enhancement to the radio art would be PSK31 for example.
>>>
>>> Created by an amateur radio operator used by amateur radio operators. An
>>> amazing technology for weak signal work. Multiple conversations tacking
>>> place in a single SSB "channel."
>>>
>>> Don't misinterpret what I'm saying ... D-STAR is neat .... but if I (or
>>> someone smarter than me) can't fabricate it from core technologies it
>>> can't
>>> be fully understood or improved upon. Which is what this hobby is suppose
>>> to be about.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
>>>>
>>>> PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM
>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "To help the believer " :-)
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it
>>>>>> in a long time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the
>>>>>> radio art!!!!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM
>>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "To help the non beleiver.. "
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way
>>>>>>> repeaters
>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>> ... but I digress)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the
>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>> art ... it does not promote innovation ...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever
>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>> need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've
>>>>>>> learned
>>>>>>> nothing and you've given nothing back.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any
>>>>>>> value
>>>>>>> for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the
>>>>>>> highest
>>>>>>> bidder.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, <lucleblanc6@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> > On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
>>>>>>>> > > Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the >
>>>>>>>> > same
>>>>>>>> > > thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with > >
>>>>>>>> DSTAR
>>>>>>>> > > it
>>>>>>>> > > is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much >
>>>>>>>> > fun,
>>>>>>>> > > there is something for everyone
>>>>>>>> > > 73,s Damon
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. >
>>>>>>>> Only
>>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>> manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell
>>>>>>>> to a
>>>>>>>> handful of approved radio manufacturers.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the >
>>>>>>>> AMBE
>>>>>>>> codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > --
>>>>>>>> > Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>> > Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one
>>>>>>>> choose
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something
>>>>>>>> has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who
>>>>>>>> wants
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication
>>>>>>>> protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's
>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>> to say competition is already present.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The cost question.
>>>>>>>> You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> 700$
>>>>>>>> and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just
>>>>>>>> an example and i'm not connected to their business.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters-
>>>>>>>> --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1&
>>>>>>>> ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+
>>>>>>>> you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham
>>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>>> no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you
>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>> be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the
>>>>>>>> internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you
>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>> live on my planet.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just let folks live free...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Luc Leblanc VE2DWE
>>>>>>>> WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>
>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>> author.
>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>> program!
>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>> program!
>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 16:18:21 -0500
From: "STeve Andre'" <andres@xxx.xxx>
To: AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID: <52829B1D.3060306@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
*absolutely true*
We've surrendered freedoms by using this. ICOM of course had no real
understanding or appreciation of this (I've talked with higher-up managers
at Dayton), so it's become something we have to live with.
It does reek, however.
--STeve Andre'
wb8wsf en72
On 11/12/13 15:58, Rob wrote:
> If I can't duplicate the codec .... understand the codec ... improve the
> codec ... whether a ham developed it or not is irrelevant.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 8:42 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
>>
>> Last question. Do you know for a fact that
>> the AMBE codecs was not developed by
>> a ham radio operator for that company???
>> A lot of hams are in that business.
>>
>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:16 PM
>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>
>>>
>>> An example of an enhancement to the radio art would be PSK31 for
example.
>>>> Created by an amateur radio operator used by amateur radio operators. An
>>>> amazing technology for weak signal work. Multiple conversations tacking
>>>> place in a single SSB "channel."
>>>>
>>>> Don't misinterpret what I'm saying ... D-STAR is neat .... but if I (or
>>>> someone smarter than me) can't fabricate it from core technologies it
>>>> can't
>>>> be fully understood or improved upon. Which is what this hobby is suppose
>>>> to be about.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
>>>>> PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM
>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "To help the believer " :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it
>>>>>>> in a long time.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the
>>>>>>> radio art!!!!!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "To help the non beleiver.. "
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way
>>>>>>>> repeaters
>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>> ... but I digress)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the
>>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>>> art ... it does not promote innovation ...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever
>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>> need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've
>>>>>>>> learned
>>>>>>>> nothing and you've given nothing back.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any
>>>>>>>> value
>>>>>>>> for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the
>>>>>>>> highest
>>>>>>>> bidder.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, <lucleblanc6@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the >
>>>>>>>>>> same
>>>>>>>>>>> thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with > >
>>>>>>>>> DSTAR
>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>> is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much >
>>>>>>>>>> fun,
>>>>>>>>>>> there is something for everyone
>>>>>>>>>>> 73,s Damon
>>>>>>>>>> But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. >
>>>>>>>>> Only
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>> manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell
>>>>>>>>> to a
>>>>>>>>> handful of approved radio manufacturers.
>>>>>>>>>> It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the >
>>>>>>>>> AMBE
>>>>>>>>> codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>> To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one
>>>>>>>>> choose
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something
>>>>>>>>> has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who
>>>>>>>>> wants
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication
>>>>>>>>> protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's
>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>> to say competition is already present.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The cost question.
>>>>>>>>> You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> 700$
>>>>>>>>> and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just
>>>>>>>>> an example and i'm not connected to their business.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters-
>>>>>>>>> --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1&
>>>>>>>>> ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+
>>>>>>>>> you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham
>>>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>>>> no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you
>>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>> be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the
>>>>>>>>> internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you
>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>> live on my planet.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just let folks live free...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Luc Leblanc VE2DWE
>>>>>>>>> WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2013 15:59:44 -0600
From: Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
To: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>, <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP351CD20CC27C233540A3F3CEDFE0@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
You are right. You can bring a horse to water, but
he will not drink it unless he knows how it is made and
he can modified the taste and the color. hmmmm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:58 PM
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
> If I can't duplicate the codec .... understand the codec ... improve the
> codec ... whether a ham developed it or not is irrelevant.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 8:42 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Last question. Do you know for a fact that
>> the AMBE codecs was not developed by
>> a ham radio operator for that company???
>> A lot of hams are in that business.
>>
>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:16 PM
>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>
>>>
>>> An example of an enhancement to the radio art would be PSK31 for
>>> example.
>>>>
>>>> Created by an amateur radio operator used by amateur radio operators.
>>>> An
>>>> amazing technology for weak signal work. Multiple conversations tacking
>>>> place in a single SSB "channel."
>>>>
>>>> Don't misinterpret what I'm saying ... D-STAR is neat .... but if I (or
>>>> someone smarter than me) can't fabricate it from core technologies it
>>>> can't
>>>> be fully understood or improved upon. Which is what this hobby is
>>>> suppose
>>>> to be about.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
>>>>>
>>>>> PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM
>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso <n5uxt@xxxxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "To help the believer " :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it
>>>>>>> in a long time.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises
>>>>>>> ???
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the
>>>>>>> radio art!!!!!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 7 3 de Angelo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" <pabutusa@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>>> To: <AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx>
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "To help the non beleiver.. "
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way
>>>>>>>> repeaters
>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>> ... but I digress)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>>> art ... it does not promote innovation ...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what
>>>>>>>> ever
>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>> need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've
>>>>>>>> learned
>>>>>>>> nothing and you've given nothing back.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating
>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>> value
>>>>>>>> for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the
>>>>>>>> highest
>>>>>>>> bidder.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, <lucleblanc6@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > > Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the >
>>>>>>>>> > same
>>>>>>>>> > > thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with >
>>>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>>>> DSTAR
>>>>>>>>> > > it
>>>>>>>>> > > is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much
>>>>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>>>>> > fun,
>>>>>>>>> > > there is something for everyone
>>>>>>>>> > > 73,s Damon
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. >
>>>>>>>>> Only
>>>>>>>>> > >
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>> manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only
>>>>>>>>> sell
>>>>>>>>> to a
>>>>>>>>> handful of approved radio manufacturers.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the >
>>>>>>>>> AMBE
>>>>>>>>> codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur
>>>>>>>>> radio.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > --
>>>>>>>>> > Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>>> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur
>>>>>>>>> > satellite
>>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>>> > Subscription settings:
>>>>>>>>> > http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one
>>>>>>>>> choose
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something
>>>>>>>>> has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who
>>>>>>>>> wants
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication
>>>>>>>>> protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better
>>>>>>>>> it's
>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>> to say competition is already present.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The cost question.
>>>>>>>>> You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> 700$
>>>>>>>>> and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just
>>>>>>>>> an example and i'm not connected to their business.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters-
>>>>>>>>> --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1&
>>>>>>>>> ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+
>>>>>>>>> you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not
>>>>>>>>> Ham
>>>>>>>>> radio
>>>>>>>>> no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>> be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the
>>>>>>>>> internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you
>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>> live on my planet.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just let folks live free...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Luc Leblanc VE2DWE
>>>>>>>>> WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>>>> author.
>>>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>>>> program!
>>>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>>>> author.
>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>>>> program!
>>>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the
>>>> author.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>>> program!
>>>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>> program!
>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 8, Issue 386
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