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CX2SA > SATDIG 07.08.11 15:55l 677 Lines 20519 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Today's Topics:
1. International satellite name (andy thomas)
2. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Phil Karn)
3. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Phil Karn)
4. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Jeff Yanko)
5. ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS (Mike Rupprecht)
6. Re: SatPC32 (Eric Knaps, ON4HF)
7. ARISSAT-1 qrm fm ISS ? (Andre' v Deventer)
8. Re: ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS (Alan P. Biddle)
9. ISS Packets QRM ARISSat-1 (Mike Schaffer)
10. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Phil Karn)
11. Re: Keps (Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF)
12. Re: ARISSatTLM (Phil Karn)
13. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF)
14. Re: ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS (Phil Karn)
15. ARRISat-1 SSB QSO (Clare Fowler)
16. QSO on Radioscaf-B ! (Roland Zurmely)
17. Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1 (Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF)
18. ISS Packets QRM ARISSat-1 - Update 1 (Mike Schaffer)
19. ARISSat-1 possible critical height (Giulio P. AOL)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 02:25:16 +0100 (BST)
From: andy thomas <andythomasmail@xxxxx.xx.xx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] International satellite name
To: amsat <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<1312680316.39147.YahooMailClassic@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
It struck me that i don't know why the callsign of arissat-1 is RS 01 S...
"Radio Sputnik" and "Skafandr" I understand but why 01?
While we are about it, although I don't wish to add to the names - RS01S,
Skafandr-B, Arissat-1 - shouldn't she have an Oscar designator? May I
propose MO-(number) - ie "Mezhdunarodno" (International) Oscar
73 de andy G0SFJ
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 00:34:17 -0700
From: Phil Karn <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
To: James <kb7tbt@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E3FF9.3060402@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 8/6/11 8:55 PM, James wrote:
>
> Thank you for your informative contribution..
>
> Anyone with a real answer?
Well, an educated guess can be made by looking at a plot of ISS altitude
vs time:
http://www.heavens-above.com/IssHeight.aspx
The ISS is periodically reboosted, accounting for the sudden jumps in
this sawtooth-like graph. Obviously ARISSat-1 won't be reboosted, so if
you extrapolate the downward-sloping parts of the graph you can get a
rough idea of what will happen.
The ISS orbital decay rate varies with changes in upper atmospheric
density with solar activity, but also because of changes in its attitude
and the operation of the solar panels.
The orbital decay rate also depends on qthe ballistic coefficient of the
object. This has units of mass divided by area -- the mass of the object
divided by the cross-sectional area it presents in its direction of
flight. The larger the ballistic coefficient, the less its deceleration
from drag as it flies through the thin upper atmosphere.
The ISS probably has a larger ballistic coefficient than any other
satellite simply because it's so huge. The volume of most objects
increases as the cube of the size while the cross-sectional area
increases with the square. Since mass is usually a function of volume, a
large object will generally have a higher ballistic coefficient and last
longer in a given orbit than a small object.
Obviously there are exceptions to the "large lives longer" rule such as
the "Echo" balloons. The actual ballistic coefficient for any given
satellite has to be computed from its actual mass and dimensions and its
orientation relative to its velocity vector. The ISS is a huge
satellite, but it also has lightweight solar wings that greatly increase
its cross-sectional area without increasing its mass very much, so they
decrease its ballistic coefficient somewhat.
ARISSat-1 is far smaller than the ISS, but it is fairly heavy for its
size and it lacks large solar wings that create a lot of drag. This will
reduce its decay rate, but it will still probably decay more quickly
than the ISS.
It was tossed out the back of the ISS against the velocity vector, and
that immediately put it in a lower energy orbit with a higher mean
motion. But any further increase in mean motion will be due to orbital
decay, and from that we should be able to estimate its ballistic
coefficient and how it will likely behave in the future. Determining an
exact lifetime would be difficult because of the difficulty of
predicting solar activity, but a good estimate can probably be made.
--Phil
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 00:40:14 -0700
From: Phil Karn <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E415E.70004@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
I note that, lifetime-wise, this deployment delay has actually left us
much better off. The ISS had some big reboosts in June and is now at an
altitude of about 387 km. Had we been deployed in February as originally
scheduled, the ISS would have been at an altitude of only about 352 km.
73, Phil KA9Q
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 00:47:31 -0700
From: "Jeff Yanko" <wb3jfs@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
To: "Phil Karn" <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>, "James" <kb7tbt@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <5B23B7F5255E4F4CADFA09AA5019A600@xxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
If anything, maybe this calls for another Chicken Little Contest to see who
can come the closest to predicting re-entry.
73,
Jeff WB3JFS
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Karn" <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
To: "James" <kb7tbt@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2011 12:34 AM
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
> On 8/6/11 8:55 PM, James wrote:
>>
>> Thank you for your informative contribution..
>>
>> Anyone with a real answer?
>
> Well, an educated guess can be made by looking at a plot of ISS altitude
> vs time:
>
> http://www.heavens-above.com/IssHeight.aspx
>
> The ISS is periodically reboosted, accounting for the sudden jumps in
> this sawtooth-like graph. Obviously ARISSat-1 won't be reboosted, so if
> you extrapolate the downward-sloping parts of the graph you can get a
> rough idea of what will happen.
>
> The ISS orbital decay rate varies with changes in upper atmospheric
> density with solar activity, but also because of changes in its attitude
> and the operation of the solar panels.
>
> The orbital decay rate also depends on qthe ballistic coefficient of the
> object. This has units of mass divided by area -- the mass of the object
> divided by the cross-sectional area it presents in its direction of
> flight. The larger the ballistic coefficient, the less its deceleration
> from drag as it flies through the thin upper atmosphere.
>
> The ISS probably has a larger ballistic coefficient than any other
> satellite simply because it's so huge. The volume of most objects
> increases as the cube of the size while the cross-sectional area
> increases with the square. Since mass is usually a function of volume, a
> large object will generally have a higher ballistic coefficient and last
> longer in a given orbit than a small object.
>
> Obviously there are exceptions to the "large lives longer" rule such as
> the "Echo" balloons. The actual ballistic coefficient for any given
> satellite has to be computed from its actual mass and dimensions and its
> orientation relative to its velocity vector. The ISS is a huge
> satellite, but it also has lightweight solar wings that greatly increase
> its cross-sectional area without increasing its mass very much, so they
> decrease its ballistic coefficient somewhat.
>
> ARISSat-1 is far smaller than the ISS, but it is fairly heavy for its
> size and it lacks large solar wings that create a lot of drag. This will
> reduce its decay rate, but it will still probably decay more quickly
> than the ISS.
>
> It was tossed out the back of the ISS against the velocity vector, and
> that immediately put it in a lower energy orbit with a higher mean
> motion. But any further increase in mean motion will be due to orbital
> decay, and from that we should be able to estimate its ballistic
> coefficient and how it will likely behave in the future. Determining an
> exact lifetime would be difficult because of the difficulty of
> predicting solar activity, but a good estimate can probably be made.
>
> --Phil
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 10:33:36 +0200
From: "Mike Rupprecht" <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS
To: "'AMSAT-BB'" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <001f01cc54dc$b3b825b0$1b287110$@xx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
All,
we had strong QRM on 145.950 MHz due to the ISS. Most of the ARISSat SSTV
images and voice messages were disturbed.
Just wondering why we can hear ISS packets on that frequency.
22:33 RS0ISS>CQ>UI,R,F0 (1200 baud):>ARISS - International Space Station
22:35 RS0ISS>CQ>UI,R,F0 (1199 baud):>ARISS - International Space Station
73, Mike
DK3WN
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 11:21:18 +0200
From: "Eric Knaps, ON4HF" <on4hf@xxxxxxx.xx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: SatPC32
To: "Bato, Andras" <bato@xxxxxxx.xx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E590E.60708@xxxxxxx.xx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hella Andras,
I am using version 12.8a.
After you insert the lines in your doppler.sqf file, restart the
program, click on satellites and select "amateur.txt" as source file.
RADIOSCAF-B should be at the bottom of the list. If not, click on
"update keps" and select the url with amateur.txt in it.
Click on the download button. and then click on "ok" in your satellites
window.
Now, open again the satellites window and select the "amateur.txt" file
and search for the RADIOSCAF-B sat and dubbel click on it.
Then select the new sat and click on "show on/off"
Click ok, and that should do it.
I hope this helps...
good luck,
Eric.
Amateur Radio Station ON4HF
Eric Knaps
Satellite manager UBA
Tel. +32472985876 (mobile)
http://www.on4hf.be
Op 6/08/2011 22:05, Bato, Andras schreef:
> Hi Eric ON4HF,
>
> I wonder which version of SatPC32 are you using?
>
> I have put your lines into DOPPLER.SQF file but it does not do any change!
>
> Isn't there any mistake in those lines?
>
> Otherwise nasa.all file does not contain RADIOSCAF-B data!
>
> It can be found in amateur.txt list only!
>
> gl de ha6nn
> Andras
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 12:18:05 +0200
From: "Andre' v Deventer" <vandeventeraj@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSAT-1 qrm fm ISS ?
To: "Amsat-Bb" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <NHEDJLNPLJCJMJDIBPGKIEHHCFAA.vandeventeraj@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
This pass just gone 09h58 UTC and the previous one at 08h22 UTC both had
packet or APRS ? over the 145.950 Arissat SSTV. This last pass was just LOS
when the packet tx was again and only ISS
was still visable at my QTH.
I have recordingds but no decode of that PKT yet.
73
andre ZS2BK
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 05:45:35 -0500
From: "Alan P. Biddle" <APBIDDLE@xxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS
To: "'Mike Rupprecht'" <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xx>, "'AMSAT-BB'"
<amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <69FD2B41D0014C90BB5222A6FBC4D738@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mike,
It was being used as a crossband repeater during the earlier test, with that
as the input. Perhaps they did not change the frequency when they went back
to simplex?
Alan
WA4SCA
-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
Behalf Of Mike Rupprecht
Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2011 3:34 AM
To: 'AMSAT-BB'
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS
All,
we had strong QRM on 145.950 MHz due to the ISS. Most of the ARISSat SSTV
images and voice messages were disturbed.
Just wondering why we can hear ISS packets on that frequency.
22:33 RS0ISS>CQ>UI,R,F0 (1200 baud):>ARISS - International Space Station
22:35 RS0ISS>CQ>UI,R,F0 (1199 baud):>ARISS - International Space Station
73, Mike
DK3WN
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 05:15:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mike Schaffer <daetsort@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ISS Packets QRM ARISSat-1
To: "amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxxx <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<1312719314.16177.YahooMailNeo@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
ISS packets are coming through the 2M downlink on 145.950 FM interfering
with reception of the SSTV and voice transmissions.
?
There were two ISS packet signals noted on Saturday, August?7 at 1223 - 1243
UTC?at
AOS - San Luis Potosi, Mexico to?LOS -?New York/Vermont border. Both packet
signals occurred while over the U.S.A.
?
Not sure if the source of the packet signals are from the 145.800 worldwide
crossband FM repeater downlink channel or the 145.990 packet uplink channel.
?
Mike Schaffer
KA3JAW
Tampa, Florida
EL87SU
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 05:46:08 -0700
From: Phil Karn <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
To: Jeff Yanko <wb3jfs@xxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E8910.8000702@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 8/7/11 12:47 AM, Jeff Yanko wrote:
> If anything, maybe this calls for another Chicken Little Contest to see
> who can come the closest to predicting re-entry.
Absolutely!
As an old friend of mine used to say about his favorite game of
backgammon, this will require a combination of luck and skill.
--Phil
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 13:00:06 +0000
From: "Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF" <nigel@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Keps
To: "<amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4E3E8C56.9020407@xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
ADIOSCAF-B
1 37772U 98067CK 11219.20413008 .00027598 00000-0 33081-3 0 88
2 37772 051.6390 263.9529 0013229 054.4740 053.2135 15.60616791 459
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 06:01:10 -0700
From: Phil Karn <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSatTLM
To: n0jy@xxxx.xxx
Cc: AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxxx N0JY <n0jy@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4E3E8C96.4000206@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 8/7/11 5:59 AM, N0JY wrote:
> Phil,
>
> My Windows 7 PC with Realtek onboard sound set at 48kHz seems quite
> happy, having captured and forwarded 155 frames while I slumbered...
> So one final, please tell me what you think about the tuning (see
Well, you can't argue with success!
Phil
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 13:01:50 +0000
From: "Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF" <nigel@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
To: James <kb7tbt@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E8CBE.6010903@xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
"Fast Forward" your predix software and watch it crash.
On 08/07/2011 03:55 AM, James wrote:
> Thank you for your informative contribution..
>
> Anyone with a real answer?
>
>
> 73!
> James
> KB7TBT
> www.kb7tbt.com
>
>
> I hope it doesn't outlast my delete key!
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 06:03:11 -0700
From: Phil Karn <karn@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ARISSat: strong QRM due to ISS
To: Mike Rupprecht <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xx>
Cc: 'AMSAT-BB' <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4E3E8D0F.5080209@xxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 8/7/11 1:33 AM, Mike Rupprecht wrote:
> All,
>
> we had strong QRM on 145.950 MHz due to the ISS. Most of the ARISSat SSTV
> images and voice messages were disturbed.
>
> Just wondering why we can hear ISS packets on that frequency.
Oh so **THAT'S** where those packets were coming from! I kept hearing
them too. Not trying to decode them, I thought they were coming from
some local who hadn't turned off his packet TNC while listening to the
satellite!
Phil
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 09:05:25 -0400
From: "Clare Fowler" <clarefowler@xxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARRISat-1 SSB QSO
To: "amsat-bb" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <FF1DCFEA8AEE424BBAC8A0164266BF03@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
At 11:08 UTC Aug 7 morning pass with 20 degree elevation
VE3NPC and KB8OTH competed a QSO on ARRISat-1.
Signals were just above noise level but Q5
Clare VE3NPC
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 06:17:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Roland Zurmely <py4zbz@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] QSO on Radioscaf-B !
To: AMSAT <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<1312723035.83038.YahooMailNeo@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
QSO with Luciano PY5LF at 13:00 UTC orbit #50 !
TNX es 73 de Roland PY4ZBZ.
------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2011 13:23:47 +0000
From: "Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF" <nigel@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Life Expectancy ARISat-1
To: James <kb7tbt@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4E3E91E3.9020304@xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Fast Forwarding using the current keps, it first kisses the earth in
central Africa on 2013/06/24 at 11:26Z
------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 06:29:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mike Schaffer <daetsort@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ISS Packets QRM ARISSat-1 - Update 1
To: "amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxxx <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<1312723768.24036.YahooMailNeo@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I misstated the UTC time in the original message. It?should have been 0423 -
0443,
which is 12:23?-?12:43 am local EDT.?
?
On the latest pass, August 7, 1243 - 1247 UTC ISS packets are still coming
through the 2M downlink on 145.950 FM interfering with reception of the SSTV
and voice transmissions.
?
Two packet signals occurred while over the U.S.A. and one while south of
Pinar del Rio,
Cuba.?
?
?
Mike Schaffer
KA3JAW
Tampa, Florida
EL87SU
------------------------------
Message: 19
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 09:44:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Giulio P. AOL" <giuliop70@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 possible critical height
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <8CE231F5091003C-1BB4-14723@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
what could be the critical height (closest to the earth) for the
satellite, where the temperatures will degrade the operation?
thanks
Giulio AB2VY
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 6, Issue 441
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