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CX2SA > SATDIG 10.04.11 21:02l 669 Lines 21802 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: The Need for Phonetics (Mark Spencer)
2. Re: anybody hear Arissat-1 yet? (Clint Bradford)
3. ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Clint Bradford)
4. Re: The Need for Phonetics (Glen Zook)
5. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Glen Zook)
6. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (KM9U)
7. Part 97 sec97.119 B2 (wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxxx
8. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Clint Bradford)
9. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Clint Bradford)
10. ARISSat-1 startup sequence (Gould Smith)
11. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (John Becker)
12. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Joe)
13. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (Glen Zook)
14. Re: Part 97 sec97.119 B2 (Glen Zook)
15. Wanted: ARISSat-1 audio recordings (Douglas Quagliana)
16. Re: The Need for Phonetics (Art McBride)
17. Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo (John Becker)
18. AMSAT-SA site down? (George Henry)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 09:14:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Spencer <mspencer12345@xxxxx.xx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: The Need for Phonetics
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <811969.15440.qm@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve of mine especially where
there
is a brief pause between kilo and watt.?? When I hear kilo I assume the
letter k
is being represented, then when I hear watt I have to decide if the sender is
also representing the letter w or not.
It seems overly confusing to me.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 09:16:30 -0700
From: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: anybody hear Arissat-1 yet?
To: "Mark L. Hammond" <marklhammond@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <AECBB829-228C-4147-9A75-88FB208FBC6F@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Thought maybe you knew of an informal testing period ...
SEE? I gave you the benefit of the vast knowledge you possess ...
With ARISSat-1 in low power mode, I just hope folks won;t "give up" when
they don't immediately hear it when they KNOW it's above them.
SPECIAL ADDED EXCITEMENT - Our second pass (5:32AM PDT 04/12) just might be
VISIBLE for a few minutes here in Southern CA!!!!!
Clint
On Apr 10, 2011, at 9:13 AM, Mark L. Hammond wrote:
Doh! Wrong day :)
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 09:19:49 -0700
From: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <491531C6-9B1F-4DC5-A623-22E9268B2F8B@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
>> ... The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve ...
Not an ITU-approved term. "K" is "kilo."
SOURCE: ARRL Handy Ops Guide's ITU Phonetics:
http://web.me.com/clintbradford/Work-Sat/Shack_Aids.html
Clint, K6LCS
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 09:32:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glen Zook <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: The Need for Phonetics
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxxx Mark Spencer <mspencer12345@xxxxx.xx>
Message-ID: <63458.94909.qm@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Although some people say kilowatt is two words, it definitely is not. In
over 50 years of using "kilowatt" as a phonetic I have not once had a
station think it is KW. Kilowatt makes it through QRM and QSB a LOT better
than "kilo". Some operators do use "Kansas" or "Korea" for the letter "K".
Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Mark Spencer <mspencer12345@xxxxx.xx> wrote:
The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve of mine especially where
there is a brief pause between kilo and watt.?? When I hear kilo I assume
the letter k is being represented, then when I hear watt I have to decide if
the sender is also representing the letter w or not.
It seems overly confusing to me.
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 09:42:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glen Zook <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>, Clint Bradford
<clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <200352.37469.qm@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Neither are geographic names recommended by the ITU. However, geographic
names do work considerably better under certain conditions.
Had the FCC required that the ICAO phonetics be used such would be stated in
47 CFR Part 97. However, the identification procedures for phone operation
are "spelled out" in 47 CFR Part 97 Section 97.119(b)(2) which reads as
follows:
(2) By a phone emission in the English language. Use of a phonetic alphabet
as an aid for correct station identification is encouraged;
Please note that the regulations suggest "A PHONETIC ALPHABET", not the ICAO
phonetic alphabet. There are actually several accepted phonetic alphabets
in use including the APCO phonetic alphabet which is used in Public Safety
communications here in the United States. That phonetic alphabet shares few
phonetics with the ICAO phonetics.
Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx> wrote:
... The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve ...
Not an ITU-approved term. "K" is "kilo."
SOURCE: ARRL Handy Ops Guide's ITU Phonetics:
http://web.me.com/clintbradford/Work-Sat/Shack_Aids.html
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 12:47:25 -0400
From: "KM9U" <arskm9u@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: "AMSAT BB" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <6E83895FF7844DF0B22587CE97C2DAD8@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
"Whiskey" confuses me ;-))
Chuck, Kilo Mike Niner Uniform
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clint Bradford" <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
To: "AMSAT BB" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 12:19
Subject: [amsat-bb] ITU Phonetics - Kilo
>>> ... The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve ...
>
> Not an ITU-approved term. "K" is "kilo."
>
> SOURCE: ARRL Handy Ops Guide's ITU Phonetics:
> http://web.me.com/clintbradford/Work-Sat/Shack_Aids.html
>
> Clint, K6LCS
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 17:11:56 +0000 (UTC)
From: wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] Part 97 sec97.119 B2
To: AMSAT <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<42527941.844937.1302455516538.JavaMail.root@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx.xx.xxxx.xxxxx
xx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
http://www.w5yi.org/page.php?id=124
(2) By a phone emission in the English language. Use of {a phonetic
alphabet} as an aid for correct station identification is encouraged;
So we can use any form of word to letter that is necessary to ID a ham
station
There is no set legal phonetic alphabet in place per the FCC part 97
I can legaly say HOT FRIDAY NIGHT for HFN and it is ok. Also no one can
require you to use a certian phonetic alphabeton the ham bands , it can be
requested but not required
WA4HFN em55 Damon
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 10:24:50 -0700
From: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: Glen Zook <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <F30DAA37-1711-438F-AADE-E37C5598DF75@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
I respect most everyone here's opinions, Glen. But I think we have to agree
that if could at least get folks to RECOGNIZE that there are "formal"
phonetics that should be used while working the satellites - and the use of
them - if preferable to me announcing, for example, that I am working from
"Dandy Michelle Zip Three."
(grin)
Clint, K6LCS
http://www.work-sat.com
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 10:26:44 -0700
From: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <307BEDA0-6C45-46D9-94C6-EADD10CA89C9@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
>> ... "Whiskey" confuses me ...
It's usually rum in my pina coladas that confuses me ...
Clint
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 13:37:10 -0400
From: "Gould Smith" <gouldsmi@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ARISSat-1 startup sequence
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <861B14AF038843B6A5284E96DC0C2680@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
FYI
The task for the cosmonauts to turn on ARISSat-1 is scheduled to begin at
1430 UTC on April 11. That means that they will begin the procedure of
getting the satellite, moving the antenna coax, adjusting the antenna
switches in the ISS, then flipping the three switches on the satellite
control panel to ON. These switches and the circuitry are designed to keep
the satellite from transmitting for 15 minutes after all three switches are
in the On position. This was done so as not to pose any hazard to the
cosmonauts during the EVA to deploy the satellite.
Given all these activities I suspect that there will be no transmissions
until around 1500 UTC. According to my tracking software this puts the first
coverage area in the southeastern Pacific. Other than ships, southern South
America should be the first area to hear the
ARISSat-1/RadioSkaf-V signals.
The satellite will be in Low Power mode, 40-60 seconds ON and 2 minutes OFF.
An average 8 minute pass will only have about three transmission periods and
two minutes can seem very long when waiting for a signal to appear. Be patient
The varying ON times occur because when the On timer expires the current FM
transmission item (ID, telemetry, greeting, SSTV) will finish before the
transmitter shuts off.
Enjoy the event in celebration of the 50th Anniversary of man's first trip
into space. Yuri Gagarin make the historic trip on 12 April 1961.
73,
Gould, WA4SXM
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 12:41:19 -0500
From: John Becker <w0jab@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20110410123446.02e11440@xxxx.xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Some of us have our ears ready for the "standard" phonetics
when some comes out with "mississippi whiskey runner" for
MWR I got to stop and think "what did he just say"
John, W0JAB
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 12:52:16 -0500
From: Joe <nss@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4DA1EE50.9020408@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
I don't get confused, I just get so I don't care.
Joe WB9SBD
The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com
On 4/10/2011 12:26 PM, Clint Bradford wrote:
>>> ... "Whiskey" confuses me ...
> It's usually rum in my pina coladas that confuses me ...
>
> Clint
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 10:54:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glen Zook <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <460451.86195.qm@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I agree that particular phonetics are appropriate for certain situations.
"Funny phonetics" are best left for FM repeater operations and other certain
contacts where everyone knows each other.
In the world of DXing geographical names have become the defacto standard
because the ICAO phonetics just don't work in many situations. For most,
but not all, satellite communications I definitely believe that the ICAO
phonetics are fine and should be used. However, when one of the stations
does not have English as their primary language then geographical names
usually do work better.
Now coming up with alternates that are supposedly funny, or that are not
readily recognizable, is a completely different matter. The purpose of
having a phonetic alphabet is to get the information through in the most
efficient manner and doing so involves use of words that have, at least try
to have, a universal recognition.
As I said before, this topic comes up for discussion on QRZ.com on a regular
basis. There are those who absolutely insist that only the ICAO phonetics
are to be used even when they don't work. There are even a few who insist
that using the ICAO phonetics is a matter of FCC regulation. Then there are
a very few who say "anything goes". Virtually all of those who work DX and
contests on a regular basis go with the geographical names. With the
exception of the person who posts the original comment, virtually all of the
comments are exactly the same, posted by the same individuals, that have
been posted numerous times before. Sometimes I wish that the individual
comments were numbered and the person could just post that number and not
take up bandwidth! :>)
Again, I have no objections to the ICAO phonetics and use them the majority
of the time. But, when the situation is changed (like working DX) I usually
resort to geographical names because they convey the information much faster
when the person on the other end does not speak English as their primary
language.
Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Clint Bradford <clintbradford@xxx.xxx> wrote:
I respect most everyone here's opinions, Glen. But I think we have to agree
that if could at least get folks to RECOGNIZE that there are "formal"
phonetics that should be used while working the satellites - and the use of
them - if preferable to me announcing, for example, that I am working from
"Dandy Michelle Zip Three."
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:01:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glen Zook <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Part 97 sec97.119 B2
To: AMSAT <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>, wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <609074.44656.qm@xxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
That is absolutely true in that any, at least any non-profane, word can be
used as a phonetic. However, readily recognizable words definitely work
better. That is why there are standard phonetic alphabets including the
ICAO and APCO. In the world of working DX geographical names have become a
defacto standard phonetic alphabet.
Now when working your friends on a local FM repeater, then "funny phonetics"
are fine since they know who you are.
The late Jack Camp, W5HS, used to say "Whiskey Five Horse . . . . . . Shoe"
when working locals. But, when he was working DX he used "Washington Five
Honolulu Spain".
Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxx <wa4hfn@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
http://www.w5yi.org/page.php?id=124
(2) By a phone emission in the English language. Use of {a phonetic
alphabet} as an aid for correct station identification is encouraged;
So we can use any form of word to letter that is necessary to ID a ham
station There is no set legal phonetic alphabet in place per the FCC part 97
I can legaly say HOT FRIDAY NIGHT for HFN and it is ok. Also no one can
require you to use a certian phonetic alphabeton the ham bands , it can be
requested but not required
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 14:07:39 -0400
From: Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Wanted: ARISSat-1 audio recordings
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Cc: ans-editor@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <8CDC5C1503B53E6-20D4-2E982@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
First call for ARISSat-1 audio recordings
If you haven't already heard about it, ARISSat-1 will be activated
while still inside the International Space Station. The transmissions
are scheduled to begin around Monday 11 April 2011 at 14:30 UTC
and continue until 10:30 UTC on 13 April 2011.
The satellite will be running off of the battery, so the transmissions
will be only 40-60 second long. There will be a delay of about two
minutes between transmissions. That is, about 40-60 seconds ON,
then about two minutes OFF (silence).
If you are able to make an audio recording of the signals from
ARISSat-1, I would be very interested in obtaining a copy of your
recording. I would be most interested in recordings of the CW and
BPSK signals, but if are able to record the voice and SSTV signals
I would be interested in those too.
If you can make an SDR recordings ( I and Q ) with a Funcube
dongle, FlexRadio, or SDR-IQ, record at the highest rate that your
hardware and software supports. If you are making a regular audio
recording, set the sampling rate to the "highest quality." If you can
choose sample sizes, for example between 8-bit and 16-bit samples,
choose the largest size.
If you get any recordings with any of the signals from ARISSat,
I would be very interested in obtaining a copy even if the recording
is huge.
Save your recordings as .WAV files. Don't use MP3 format and
don't convert the recordings into MP3 recordings. Leave the
recordings as big huge .WAV files.
If you successfully record ARISSat-1's signals, please contact me
for details on how to get the recording to me.
Douglas KA2UPW/5
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:28:52 -0700
From: "Art McBride" <kc6uqh@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: The Need for Phonetics
To: "'Glen Zook'" <gzook@xxxxx.xxx>, <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>, "'Mark
Spencer'" <mspencer12345@xxxxx.xx>
Message-ID: <6DE40EB887B54CC6A6154A61D3B9674C@xxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Glen,
Engineers use KW for kilowatt. That might explain my confusion using KW
abbreviation as an occupation for 30 years before becoming an Amateur Radio
Operator.
Art,
KC6UQH
-----Original Message-----
From: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx On
Behalf Of Glen Zook
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 9:33 AM
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxxx Mark Spencer
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: The Need for Phonetics
Although some people say kilowatt is two words, it definitely is not. In
over 50 years of using "kilowatt" as a phonetic I have not once had a
station think it is KW. Kilowatt makes it through QRM and QSB a LOT better
than "kilo". Some operators do use "Kansas" or "Korea" for the letter "K".
Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
--- On Sun, 4/10/11, Mark Spencer <mspencer12345@xxxxx.xx> wrote:
The use of Kilowatt as a phonetic is a pet peeve of mine especially where
there is a brief pause between kilo and watt.?? When I hear kilo I assume
the letter k is being represented, then when I hear watt I have to decide if
the sender is also representing the letter w or not.
It seems overly confusing to me.
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 13:29:06 -0500
From: John Becker <w0jab@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: ITU Phonetics - Kilo
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20110410132252.026783e0@xxxx.xxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
There is a "STANDARD" why not use it???
(that was a question)
My navy training just rubs me the wrong way
when I hear some of the "words" being used
by some.
Could be the "reason" your call went unanswered.
John, W0JAB
------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:59:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: George Henry <ka3hsw@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] AMSAT-SA site down?
To: AMSAT <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <903776.35733.qm@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Haven't been able to get to the AMSAT-SA website for several days...? anyone
know offhand when the ops over North America end(ed)?
George, KA3HSW
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 6, Issue 199
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