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CX2SA > SATDIG 11.04.10 03:55l 1227 Lines 40008 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Today's Topics:
1. N. Europe AO-7 (Bob- W7LRD)
2. satpc32/moon (Bob- W7LRD)
3. Re: satpc32/moon (Dave Webb KB1PVH)
4. Re: satpc32/moon (Mark Hammond N8MH)
5. Re: AO-51 power up, PL test tomorrow (Andrew Glasbrenner)
6. usb to serial adapter woes (Larry Gerhardstein)
7. ANS-101 AMSAT Weekly Bulletins (Lee McLamb)
8. Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK (Nathaniel S. Parsons)
9. Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK (Tom Azlin N4ZPT)
10. Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK (Tom Azlin N4ZPT)
11. Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce (some calculations) (i8cvs)
12. Re: Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce (some calculations) (Idle-Tyme)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 20:00:13 +0000 (UTC)
From: Bob- W7LRD <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] N. Europe AO-7
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<1797973310.4351041270929613471.JavaMail.root@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xx.xxxx.xxxxx
xx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Real soon at 2040Z I will have a good footprint into N. Europe, maybe even
Eric in PA1, around 145952+/- CW
73 Bob W7LRD
CN87wk
Seattle
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 20:54:14 +0000 (UTC)
From: Bob- W7LRD <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] satpc32/moon
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<1085331618.4362811270932854396.JavaMail.root@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xx.xxxx.xxxxx
xx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Can we get satpc32 to track the moon?
73 Bob W7LRD
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:12:32 -0400
From: Dave Webb KB1PVH <kb1pvh@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: satpc32/moon
To: Bob- W7LRD <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Cc: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<j2z4be5f191004101412qd96424degee3ea20e7e5ff889@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Bob,
The program SuM that comes with SATPC32 will do that for you.
Dave -KB1PVH
Sent from my Verizon Wireless DROID
On Apr 10, 2010 5:04 PM, "Bob- W7LRD" <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote:
Can we get satpc32 to track the moon?
73 Bob W7LRD
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:22:40 +0000
From: "Mark Hammond N8MH" <marklhammond@xxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: satpc32/moon
To: "Bob- W7LRD" <w7lrd@xxxxxxx.xxx>, amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxxx
amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID:
<1682718051-1270934612-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-983405465-@xxx
xxx.xxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain
Can you use the SuM program that comes with it instead? Check your menu...
73, Mark N8MH
------Original Message------
From: Bob- W7LRD
Sender: amsat-bb-bounces@xxxxx.xxx
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Subject: [amsat-bb] satpc32/moon
Sent: Apr 10, 2010 4:54 PM
Can we get satpc32 to track the moon?
73 Bob W7LRD
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 18:27:46 -0400
From: Andrew Glasbrenner <glasbrenner@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: AO-51 power up, PL test tomorrow
To: Amsat-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>, AO51 Modes <ao51-modes@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4BC0FB62.6040505@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
PL is on as of about 2215Z. Before LOS I heard it drop twice for a
second or two until it heard a valid tone again. This will happen about
every 120 seconds. Reports are welcome, especially from remote users/areas.
73, Drew KO4MA
Andrew Glasbrenner wrote:
> Well, the PL mode is still off. We'll try again this afternoon.
>
> 73, Drew KO4MA
>
> Andrew Glasbrenner wrote:
>
>> This evening I shut the 435.150 transmitter off and raised 435.300 to
>> near 2 watts output. Tomorrow morning I plan to turn on the new PL
>> routine. This improved routine will turn the downlink on with an
>> unsquelched uplink when it hears a 67 hz tone. I plan on leaving a tail
>> of several minutes, so the transmitter will stay on without hearing a
>> tone for an interval of several minutes.
>>
>> What does this mean for the user? It would be helpful to program in a 67
>> hz PL tone again, but not absolutely required as long as someone else in
>> the footprint does. It also means if you are the first person in the
>> footprint (not very likely in North America, Europe, or Japan) you might
>> not hear the satellite until after it hears 67hz for a few seconds.
>>
>> If all goes well, we'll continue this mode through the mode change
>> Sunday night. Reports from when the downlink turns on or off would be
>> appreciated.
>>
>> 73, Drew KO4MA
>> AMSAT-NA VP Operations
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:36:32 -0600
From: Larry Gerhardstein <gerhardstein@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] usb to serial adapter woes
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4BC10B80.4000706@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
I hope someone can shed light. I'm using SatPC32, but that does not
affect this problem.
Awhile back I was forced to recycle both of my older computers that had
one built in 9-pin serial port. Then, I connected the built-in port to
the GS-232B rotor interface. I also purchased some HL USB-RS232
USB-to-Serial adapters, a cable with USB on one end and a 9 pin RS232 on
the other end. I used this gadget to control my transceiver (which is a
IC910H).
Now I have a new computer which has no (zero) built in serial ports.
I'm trying to use two of the USB-to-Serial gadgets and have run into
trouble. If I disconnect all grounding back through the power, I can
get one of the two to work, either the rotor or the rig-control, but not
both at the same time. Without disconnecting grounding, neither work.
It does not matter whether I'm plugging the USB ends directly into the
computer, using a passive USB hub, or a powered hub--same result.
All I have to do to get this to fail...is... Even if the USB ends are
not plugged into the computer and the rig control box is powered off and
unplugged from power, if I just touch the metal shield on the USB cable
going to the rig control onto the shield connection in the computer or
hub, that causes the rotor control to fail. When it fails, The azimuth
reading on the G-5500 drops all the way to zero. The elevation meter is
unaffected.
It acts like a ground loop somewhere, but where and how? I've tried
disconnecting the coaxes from the transceiver but no change.
I'm thinking about scrapping these USB-to-Serial things and going to a
4-Port Keyspan box.
HELP!!
73, Larry W7IN - DN27 in Plains, Montana
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:11:22 -0400
From: Lee McLamb <ku4os@xxx.xx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] ANS-101 AMSAT Weekly Bulletins
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <E1.92.27200.BB121CB4@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
AMSAT NEWS SERVICE
ANS-101
ANS is a free, weekly, news and information service of AMSAT North America,
The
Radio Amateur Satellite Corporation. ANS reports on the activities of a
worldwide group of Amateur Radio operators who share an active interest in
designing, building, launching and communicating through analog and digital
Amateur Radio satellites.
Please send any amateur satellite news or reports to:
ans-editor@xxxxx.xxx
********************************************************************
* The AMSAT team is preparing for the 2010 Dayton Hamvention AMSAT *
* Booth and activities. For the latest information go to: *
* http://www.amsat.org/amsat-new/hamvention/2010/Dayton.php *
********************************************************************
In this edition:
* AO-51 New PL Operation Being Tested
* Deadline Approaching To Reserve Rooms in AMSAT Block At Dayton
* USSTRATCOM Approves Continued AMSAT TLE Distribution
* Ten Hams in Orbit Now
* Estonian University Plans Amateur Radio CubeSat
* Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
* ARISS Status - 5 April 2010
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.01
AO-51 New PL Operation Being Tested
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.01
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.01
Drew Glasbrenner, KO4MA, reports that AO-51's 435.150 transmitter has
been turned
off and the 435.300 transmitter raised to near 2 watts output. On Saturday, 10
April, the new PL routine was turned on. This improved routine will turn the
downlink on with an unsquelched uplink when it hears a 67 hz tone. The plan is
to leave a tail of several minutes, so the transmitter will stay on without
hearing a tone for an interval of several minutes.
What does this mean for the user? It would be helpful to program in a 67
hz PL tone again, but not absolutely required as long as someone else in
the footprint does. It also means if you are the first person in the
footprint (not very likely in North America, Europe, or Japan) you might
not hear the satellite until after it hears 67hz for a few seconds.
Reports from when the downlink turns on or off would be
appreciated.
73, Drew KO4MA
AMSAT-NA VP Operations
[ANS thanks Drew, KO4MA, for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.02
Deadline Approaching To Reserve Rooms in AMSAT Block At Dayton
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.02
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.02
Again a friendly reminder that the cutoff date for the AMSAT block of rooms
in Dayton is April 13th. If you are planning to stay with us, please call
me at 301-589-6062 to make your reservation. I will need a credit card
number to hold the room.
[ANS thanks Martha for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.03
USSTRATCOM Approves Continued AMSAT TLE Distribution
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.03
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.03
AMSAT-NA Orbital Data Manager Ray Hoad, WA5QGD said this week, "I am
pleased to announce that AMSAT NA has received approval to continue
re-distribution of Keplerian elements from the USSTRATCOM data source
(Space Track website) for the period April 1, 2010 to April 1, 2011.
Thanks to the USSTRATCOM team and especially to Mr. Mark Riddle for their
help in this process."
This means that the AMSAT Keplerian Elements in verbose format and the
2-line format can be freely distributed by those who recieve them from
AMSAT. AMSAT's two formats are each considered an AMSAT product and
therefore can be freely distributed. AMSAT asks that AMSAT-NA be given
credit as the source for your redistribution.
[ANS thanks Ray Hoad, WA5QGD for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.04
Ten Hams in Orbit Now
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.04
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.04
Six of the seven astronauts on the shuttle Discovery are licensed
radio amateurs and will join four radio hams already on the Inter-
national Space Station (ISS).
The shuttle Discovery (STS131) crew consists of:
Dorothy Metcalf-Lindenburger, KE5DAT
Stephanie Wilson, KD5DZE
Naoko Yamazaki, KE5DAS
James P. Dutton, Jr., KE5HOE,
Rick Mastracchio, KC5ZTE,
Clayton Anderson, KD5PLA
Alan Poindexter
Already onboard the ISS are radio hams:
Tracy Caldwell Dyson, KF5DBF
Timothy J. Creamer, KC5WKI
Soichi Noguchi, KD5TVP
Mikhail Kornienko, RN3BF
along with Oleg Kotov and Alexander Skvortsov.
[ANS thanks SouthGate ARC and ISS Fan Club for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.05
Estonian University Plans Amateur Radio CubeSat
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.05
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.05
IARU Amateur Satellite Frequency Coordination reports the University
of Tartu, Estonia, has submitted a frequency coordination application
to the IARU for an Amateur Radio CubeSat called ESTCube-1.
The proposal is for a 1U CubeSat in Low Earth Orbit (LEO) with UHF
downlinks and a VHF telecommand uplink. It is hoped to launch in 2012
although no launch opportunity has yet been confirmed.
ESTCube-1 will carry a camera to acquire images of Estonia for out
reach purposes and will deploy a 10 meter conductive Hoytether as a
part of the development work of an electric solar wind sail.
ESTCube
http://tinyurl.com/yk66s2o
[ANS thanks IARU for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.06
Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.06
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.06
The Arecibo Observatory Amateur Radio Club will be putting the
1000-foot radio telescope on the air for 432 MHz EME from April 16-18.
It can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon
The scheduled times of operation are:
April 16: 1645 - 1930 UTC
April 17: 1740 - 2020 UTC
April 18: 1840 - 2125 UTC
Callsign: KP4AO
Tx Frequency: 432.045 MHz
Rx Frequency: 432.050 to 432.060+
Tx power: 400 W
Antenna gain: 60 dBi
System noise temp: 120 K (cold sky)
System noise temp: 330 K (when pointed at moon)
KP4AO can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon and a
good receiver. A 15 dBi antenna and 100 W will be enough to work us on
CW.
Operators at KP4AO will do their best to work as many stations as
possible. Each session will start with a brief announcement and CQ in
SSB. SSB QSOs may continue for 30 minutes to an hour, if the QSO rate
remains high.
The mode will be shifted to CW as soon as it is judged that higher QSO
rates would result.
We will listen for calls at frequencies 5-15 kHz higher than our own,
and even higher if QRM warrants. Callers who s-p-r-e-a-d o-u-t are more
likely to be copied.
If you've already worked us in any mode, please do not call again --
give others a chance.
If we call "CQ QRP", we will listen for stations running 100 W or less
to a single yagi. Please do not answer such a CQ if you are running more
power or have a larger antenna.
On April 18, if we reach a condition where most calling stations have
been worked, and we judge that operating in the digital mode JT65B would
produce a higher QSO rate, we will switch to JT65B.
Note that any of these planned operating strategies may be changed as
circumstances dictate.
We are extremely fortunate to have been granted access to the world's
largest radio telescope for this amateur radio good-will event. We look
forward to working as many stations as possible in the alloted time!
[ANS thanks John, KB1MGI, for the above information]
SB SAT @ AMSAT $ANS-101.07
ARISS Status - 5 April 2010
AMSAT News Service Bulletin 101.07
From AMSAT HQ SILVER SPRING, MD.
April 11, 2010
To All RADIO AMATEURS
BID: $ANS-101.07
1. Astronaut Soichi Noguchi Chats with Texas Students via ARISS Contact
On Monday, March 29, Walnut Creek Elementary School students in Azle,
Texas took
part in an Amateur Radio on the International Space Station (ARISS)
contact with
JAXA astronaut Soichi Noguchi, KD5TVP. All 23 questions were answered with
time
for a two way "Goodbye." ARISS was integrated into the science curriculum as
students researched space objects and gave presentations to their class. The
youth also attended satellite communications demonstrations given by retired
Lockheed employees and members of local radio clubs. On the day of
the contact,
a proclamation was read by an Azle City representative declaring it to be
Space
Day in Azle. Four television stations and one local newspaper
covered the event
and the audio was available on EchoLink.
2. HAMEX 2010 ARISS Exhibit
HAMEX 2010, the largest RadioFest in Canada, was held on Saturday, March 27 in
Toronto. AMSAT (Radio Amateur Satellite Corporation) and ARISS
(Amateur Radio on
the International Space Station) members attended the event and manned an
exhibition booth which displayed two mini satellite communications stations as
well as information boards with pictures of astronauts involved in the ARISS
program. A large AMSAT banner was posted, along with two 7 foot posters on
loan
from the Canada Space Agency (CSA). CSA also provided handouts, stickers and
various magnetic logos, which along with pamphlets describing AMSAT and the
ARISS program, were distributed to the many visitors the exhibit attracted.
The
event was a success in generating interest in the ARISS program and
the team was
invited back next year.
[ANS thanks Carol, KB3LKI, for the above information]
In addition to regular membership, AMSAT offers membership in the President's
Club. Members of the President's Club, as sustaining donors to AMSAT Project
Funds, will be eligible to receive additional benefits. Application forms are
available from the AMSAT Office.
73,
This week's ANS Editor,
Lee McLamb, KU4OS
ku4os at amsat dot org
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:22:58 -0400
From: "Nathaniel S. Parsons" <nsp25@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK
To: Tom Azlin N4ZPT <n4zpt@xxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID:
<h2qe9267a811004101822v312e9be8uc2beb0675087ff4f@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hi Tom,
My mind had indeed played a trick on me, and I remembered MFSK as MSK.
As far as the DStar group goes, I don't see any mention of 4800 bps or 4k8
kbps on the public page, so if it's not the group's focus, I don't want to
have to rely on that solution.
Thanks,
-Nate KC2SVI
On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Tom Azlin N4ZPT <n4zpt@xxx.xxx> wrote:
> Hi Nate,
>
> I was not aware MixW had MSK in it but still identical to GMSK. Perhaps you
> are thinking of MFSK? In the MixW program there is MSFK16, a multitone
> frequency shift signal, is supported, but not Minimum Shift Keying or
> Gaussian Minimum Shift Keying signals. And also FSK, aka RTTY.
>
> There is work going on to make a sound card 4800 bps 0.5 time-bandwidth
> product GMSK soundcard modems for use in GMSK DV adapters to use with D-STAR
> radios. Perhaps that could be adapted for your purpose?
>
> http://www.qsl.net/kb9mwr/projects/voip/dstar/G4KLX.html seems to describe
> some of the work.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dstar_development/ and ttp://
> groups.yahoo.com/group/pcrepeatercontroller/ are where I see the
> discussion underway.
>
> Separate discussion is using an external sound card interface like the
> Rigblaster, to connect a computer and radio.
>
> 73, Tom n4zpt
>
>
> Nathaniel S. Parsons wrote:
>
>> Can I assume MSK=GMSK? I thought they were different, but they are the
>> same,
>> and since MixW has MSK, and I could use that with a Rigblaster, etc,
>> right?
>>
>> -Nate
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:36:01 -0400
From: Tom Azlin N4ZPT <n4zpt@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK
To: "Nathaniel S. Parsons" <nsp25@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4BC12781.6050906@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi Nate,
the D-STAR protocol is only GMSK at 4800 bps and they selected a
time-bandwidth product of 0.5. 4,800 bps or 4k8 is perhaps not talked
about as that IS the standard for D-STAR. So the software there might be
adaptable. that is the reason I thought to suggest it.
Good luck and 73, Tom n4zpt
Nathaniel S. Parsons wrote:
> Hi Tom,
>
> My mind had indeed played a trick on me, and I remembered MFSK as MSK.
>
> As far as the DStar group goes, I don't see any mention of 4800 bps or 4k8
> kbps on the public page, so if it's not the group's focus, I don't want to
> have to rely on that solution.
>
> Thanks,
> -Nate KC2SVI
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 22:15:12 -0400
From: Tom Azlin N4ZPT <n4zpt@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: BeeSat at 4800 GMSK
To: "Nathaniel S. Parsons" <nsp25@xxxxxxx.xxx>
Cc: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <4BC130B0.6060603@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Well, make that the digital voice part of the protocol. The high speed
digital data part is up to 128kbps which was not what I was thinking of.
73, tom n4zpt
Tom Azlin N4ZPT wrote:
> Hi Nate,
>
> the D-STAR protocol is only GMSK at 4800 bps and they selected a
> time-bandwidth product of 0.5. 4,800 bps or 4k8 is perhaps not talked
> about as that IS the standard for D-STAR. So the software there might be
> adaptable. that is the reason I thought to suggest it.
>
> Good luck and 73, Tom n4zpt
>
>
>
> Nathaniel S. Parsons wrote:
>> Hi Tom,
>>
>> My mind had indeed played a trick on me, and I remembered MFSK as MSK.
>>
>> As far as the DStar group goes, I don't see any mention of 4800 bps or 4k8
>> kbps on the public page, so if it's not the group's focus, I don't want to
>> have to rely on that solution.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -Nate KC2SVI
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2010 04:20:04 +0200
From: "i8cvs" <domenico.i8cvs@xxx.xx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce (some
calculations)
To: "MM" <ka1rrw@xxxxx.xxx>, "AMSAT-BB" <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Message-ID: <003e01cad91d$7fb30c80$0201a8c0@xxx.xx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi All,
The specifications of the Arecibo Observatory Amateur Radio Club
for the 432 MHz Moon Bounce test on April 16-17 and 18 are as
follows:
Dish diameter: 1000 foot equivalent to 305 meters
Antenna gain: 60 dBi
Tx power: 400 W
Tx Frequency: 432.045 MHz
Since the given ERP is 243,902,443 Million Watts (see below)
and since 60 dB is equivalent to 1000000 (one Million) time in
power it comes out that the power reaching the feed of the dish is:
243902443 / 1000000 = 243 watt
The rest of the power 400-243 = 157 watt is lost in the feed line.
At 432 MHz a dish with a diameter of 305 meters has a -3dB points
main lobe angle equal to:
Theta = Lambda / Diameter = 0.69 / 305 = 0.00227 rad.
The above lobe of the dish at an average distance of 380000 km
light up a small circular surface S over the moon wich diameter is:
D = 380000 x 0.00227 = 865 km
The surface area S = (3.14 x 865^2) / 4 = 5.88 x 10^11 square meters
All the radiated power of 243 watt by the dish is now collected over
the above S area.
The reflectivity of the moon at 432 MHz is the 7% so that the power
scattered back isotropically by the moon is ( 243/100 ) x 7 = 17 watt
It is like to say that the power reflected back by the moon is 17 watt
feeding an isoptropic antenna or 17 watt EIRP or +12 dBW EIRP
radiated isotropically by the moon.
Since the surface of the moon lighed up by the dish is less then the whole
surface of the moon the usual calculation procedure for the EME link
considering the isotropic attenuation earth-moon-earth cannot be used
here because as seen by the Arecibo dish the diameter of the moon is
smaller than in reality and is large only 865 km in diameter not 3476 km
as is large in reality the moon.
With this is mind we must imagine the dish of Arecibo to be an isotropic
antenna with 17 watt applied to it and transmitting all around isotropically
from the moon.
My ground antenna has a gain G= 15 dBi and an antenna picked up noise
of 70 kelvin when looking at the cold sky
My receiving system at 432 MHz has an overall Noise Figure of 0.7 dB
equivalent to 50 kelvin so that the noise floor KTB of my receiving system
in SSB with a bandwidth of 2400 Hz is
KTB=1,38 x 10^-23 x (50 + 70) x 2400=3.97x10^-18 watt= -174 dBW
LINK BUDGED CALCULATION:
Isotropic power reflected by the moon...+12 dBW
Isotropic attenuation for 380.000 Km.. - 197 dB
-------
Power received on isotropic earth ant... - 185 dBW
Ground antenna gain...............................+ 15 dBi
-------
Power applied to ground receiver..........- 170 dBW
Noise floor of ground receiver..............- 174 dBW
-------
Received Signal to Noise ratio S/N.......+ 4 dB
By the way when KP4AO will operate on CW I can switch on the 500 Hz
filter on my receiver and here I will gain in sensitivity 2400/500 = 4.8
time and 10 log 4.8 = 6.8 dB so that I gain 4 + 6.8 = 10.8 dB of overall
10
Signal to Noise ratio
If I can stake two 70 cm antennas with gain 15 dBi each I can gain about
another 3 dB and I can improve the S/N ratio to 10.8 + 3 = 13.8 dB
If I can stack four 70 cm antennas with gain 15 dBi each I can gain about
another 3 dB and I can improve the S/N ratio up to 13.8 + 3 = 16.8 dB
a real very strong signal on CW or 16.8 - 6.8 = 10 dB in SSB Signal to
Noise ratio wich is considered to be optimal for a comfortable reception
in SSB
By the way to work EME using a big dish having a lobe with an aperture
angle "theta" smaller than the diameter subtended by the moon wich
is about 0.5 degrees i.e. 0.0087 radiants is useful only for the big dish to
hear better those stations using smaller dishes but the big dish to be
received better by the smaller one's "must" use more power and not increase
the diameter of the dish because as soon as the moon is completely resolved
the power scattered back isotropically do not increase increasing the
diameter of the dish.
In conclusion I believe that ground stations with an antenna gain of 15 dBi
and a receiving system with an overall Noise Figure of about 1 dB can easily
hear KP4AO on CW and barely in the noise on SSB
Stations with the same receiver overall Noise Figure and antenna gain from
18 to 21 dB can hear KP4AO on CW and SSB without problems.
Stations using 100 watt or more and the above antennas ranging from 15 dBi
to 21 dBi have chance to make QSO with KP4AO on CW
The above calculation shows that it is very difficult to hear KP4AO or be
heard using a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon.
Have fun
73" de
i8CVS Domenico
----- Original Message -----
From: "MM" <ka1rrw@xxxxx.xxx>
To: <amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 3:06 PM
Subject: [amsat-bb] Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
> Hi all:
> Here is a EME event you cant miss.
> Dust off your CW key, its time for Satellite, QRP EME.
>
> The 1,000 foot dish has 60 dBi on 432 mc and 400 watts.
> That comes out to be approximately 243,902,443 Million Watts ERP.
>
> enjoy
>
> wf1f
> www.marexgm.org
>
> (thanks to KB1MGI for passing on this data)
>
>
> Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
>
> The Arecibo Observatory Amateur Radio Club will be putting the
> 1000-foot radio telescope on the air for 432 MHz EME from April 16-18.
>
> It can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon
>
> The scheduled times of operation are:
>
> April 16: 1645 - 1930 UTC
>
> April 17: 1740 - 2020 UTC
>
> April 18: 1840 - 2125 UTC
>
> Callsign: KP4AO
>
> Tx Frequency: 432.045 MHz
>
> Rx Frequency: 432.050 to 432.060+
>
> Tx power: 400 W
>
> Antenna gain: 60 dBi
>
> System noise temp: 120 K (cold sky)
>
> System noise temp: 330 K (when pointed at moon)
>
> KP4AO can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon and a
> good receiver. A 15 dBi antenna and 100 W will be enough to work us on
> CW.
>
> Operators at KP4AO will do their best to work as many stations as
> possible. Each session will start with a brief announcement and CQ in
> SSB. SSB QSOs may continue for 30 minutes to an hour, if the QSO rate
> remains high.
>
> The mode will be shifted to CW as soon as it is judged that higher QSO
> rates would result.
>
> We will listen for calls at frequencies 5-15 kHz higher than our own,
> and even higher if QRM warrants. Callers who s-p-r-e-a-d o-u-t are more
> likely to be copied.
>
> If you've already worked us in any mode, please do not call again --
> give others a chance.
>
> If we call "CQ QRP", we will listen for stations running 100 W or less
> to a single yagi. Please do not answer such a CQ if you are running more
> power or have a larger antenna.
>
> On April 18, if we reach a condition where most calling stations have
> been worked, and we judge that operating in the digital mode JT65B would
> produce a higher QSO rate, we will switch to JT65B.
>
> Note that any of these planned operating strategies may be changed as
> circumstances dictate.
>
> We are extremely fortunate to have been granted access to the world's
> largest radio telescope for this amateur radio good-will event. We look
> forward to working as many stations as possible in the alloted time!
>
> >From QRZ.COM
>
> KB1MGI
>
> Moon-Net Email reflector
>
> http://list- serv.davidv. net/mailman/ ...erv.davidv. net
>
> Moon Bounce information
>
> http://www.vhfdx. info/eme. html
>
> UK Ham makes EME contact with just 25 watts
>
> http://www.southgat earc.org/ news/jan. ..me_contact. htm
>
> Earth-Moon-Earth with 20 Watts
>
> http://www.southgat earc.org/ news/jan. ..h_20_watts. htm
>
> WSJT Software for EME
>
> http://www.physics. princeton. edu/pulsar/ K1JT/
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:50:29 -0500
From: Idle-Tyme <nss@xxx.xxx>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce (some
calculations)
To: amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx
Message-ID: <4BC138F5.1040303@xxx.xxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Was this sent out on april 1st?
The Original Rolling Ball Clock
Idle Tyme
Idle-Tyme.com
http://www.idle-tyme.com
On 4/10/2010 9:20 PM, i8cvs wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> The specifications of the Arecibo Observatory Amateur Radio Club
> for the 432 MHz Moon Bounce test on April 16-17 and 18 are as
> follows:
>
> Dish diameter: 1000 foot equivalent to 305 meters
> Antenna gain: 60 dBi
> Tx power: 400 W
> Tx Frequency: 432.045 MHz
>
> Since the given ERP is 243,902,443 Million Watts (see below)
> and since 60 dB is equivalent to 1000000 (one Million) time in
> power it comes out that the power reaching the feed of the dish is:
>
> 243902443 / 1000000 = 243 watt
>
> The rest of the power 400-243 = 157 watt is lost in the feed line.
>
> At 432 MHz a dish with a diameter of 305 meters has a -3dB points
> main lobe angle equal to:
>
> Theta = Lambda / Diameter = 0.69 / 305 = 0.00227 rad.
>
> The above lobe of the dish at an average distance of 380000 km
> light up a small circular surface S over the moon wich diameter is:
>
> D = 380000 x 0.00227 = 865 km
>
> The surface area S = (3.14 x 865^2) / 4 = 5.88 x 10^11 square meters
>
> All the radiated power of 243 watt by the dish is now collected over
> the above S area.
>
> The reflectivity of the moon at 432 MHz is the 7% so that the power
> scattered back isotropically by the moon is ( 243/100 ) x 7 = 17 watt
>
> It is like to say that the power reflected back by the moon is 17 watt
> feeding an isoptropic antenna or 17 watt EIRP or +12 dBW EIRP
> radiated isotropically by the moon.
>
> Since the surface of the moon lighed up by the dish is less then the whole
> surface of the moon the usual calculation procedure for the EME link
> considering the isotropic attenuation earth-moon-earth cannot be used
> here because as seen by the Arecibo dish the diameter of the moon is
> smaller than in reality and is large only 865 km in diameter not 3476 km
> as is large in reality the moon.
>
> With this is mind we must imagine the dish of Arecibo to be an isotropic
> antenna with 17 watt applied to it and transmitting all around isotropically
> from the moon.
>
> My ground antenna has a gain G= 15 dBi and an antenna picked up noise
> of 70 kelvin when looking at the cold sky
>
> My receiving system at 432 MHz has an overall Noise Figure of 0.7 dB
> equivalent to 50 kelvin so that the noise floor KTB of my receiving system
> in SSB with a bandwidth of 2400 Hz is
>
> KTB=1,38 x 10^-23 x (50 + 70) x 2400=3.97x10^-18 watt= -174 dBW
>
> LINK BUDGED CALCULATION:
>
> Isotropic power reflected by the moon...+12 dBW
> Isotropic attenuation for 380.000 Km.. - 197 dB
>
-------
> Power received on isotropic earth ant... - 185 dBW
> Ground antenna gain...............................+ 15 dBi
>
-------
> Power applied to ground receiver..........- 170 dBW
> Noise floor of ground receiver..............- 174 dBW
>
-------
> Received Signal to Noise ratio S/N.......+ 4 dB
>
> By the way when KP4AO will operate on CW I can switch on the 500 Hz
> filter on my receiver and here I will gain in sensitivity 2400/500 = 4.8
> time and 10 log 4.8 = 6.8 dB so that I gain 4 + 6.8 = 10.8 dB of overall
> 10
> Signal to Noise ratio
>
> If I can stake two 70 cm antennas with gain 15 dBi each I can gain about
> another 3 dB and I can improve the S/N ratio to 10.8 + 3 = 13.8 dB
>
> If I can stack four 70 cm antennas with gain 15 dBi each I can gain about
> another 3 dB and I can improve the S/N ratio up to 13.8 + 3 = 16.8 dB
> a real very strong signal on CW or 16.8 - 6.8 = 10 dB in SSB Signal to
> Noise ratio wich is considered to be optimal for a comfortable reception
> in SSB
>
> By the way to work EME using a big dish having a lobe with an aperture
> angle "theta" smaller than the diameter subtended by the moon wich
> is about 0.5 degrees i.e. 0.0087 radiants is useful only for the big dish to
> hear better those stations using smaller dishes but the big dish to be
> received better by the smaller one's "must" use more power and not increase
> the diameter of the dish because as soon as the moon is completely resolved
> the power scattered back isotropically do not increase increasing the
> diameter of the dish.
>
> In conclusion I believe that ground stations with an antenna gain of 15 dBi
> and a receiving system with an overall Noise Figure of about 1 dB can easily
> hear KP4AO on CW and barely in the noise on SSB
>
> Stations with the same receiver overall Noise Figure and antenna gain from
> 18 to 21 dB can hear KP4AO on CW and SSB without problems.
>
> Stations using 100 watt or more and the above antennas ranging from 15 dBi
> to 21 dBi have chance to make QSO with KP4AO on CW
>
> The above calculation shows that it is very difficult to hear KP4AO or be
> heard using a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon.
>
> Have fun
>
> 73" de
>
> i8CVS Domenico
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "MM"<ka1rrw@xxxxx.xxx>
> To:<amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 3:06 PM
> Subject: [amsat-bb] Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
>
>
>
>> Hi all:
>> Here is a EME event you cant miss.
>> Dust off your CW key, its time for Satellite, QRP EME.
>>
>> The 1,000 foot dish has 60 dBi on 432 mc and 400 watts.
>> That comes out to be approximately 243,902,443 Million Watts ERP.
>>
>> enjoy
>>
>> wf1f
>> www.marexgm.org
>>
>> (thanks to KB1MGI for passing on this data)
>>
>>
>> Arecibo on 432 MHz Moon Bounce
>>
>> The Arecibo Observatory Amateur Radio Club will be putting the
>> 1000-foot radio telescope on the air for 432 MHz EME from April 16-18.
>>
>> It can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon
>>
>> The scheduled times of operation are:
>>
>> April 16: 1645 - 1930 UTC
>>
>> April 17: 1740 - 2020 UTC
>>
>> April 18: 1840 - 2125 UTC
>>
>> Callsign: KP4AO
>>
>> Tx Frequency: 432.045 MHz
>>
>> Rx Frequency: 432.050 to 432.060+
>>
>> Tx power: 400 W
>>
>> Antenna gain: 60 dBi
>>
>> System noise temp: 120 K (cold sky)
>>
>> System noise temp: 330 K (when pointed at moon)
>>
>> KP4AO can be heard with a small hand-held yagi pointed at the moon and a
>> good receiver. A 15 dBi antenna and 100 W will be enough to work us on
>> CW.
>>
>> Operators at KP4AO will do their best to work as many stations as
>> possible. Each session will start with a brief announcement and CQ in
>> SSB. SSB QSOs may continue for 30 minutes to an hour, if the QSO rate
>> remains high.
>>
>> The mode will be shifted to CW as soon as it is judged that higher QSO
>> rates would result.
>>
>> We will listen for calls at frequencies 5-15 kHz higher than our own,
>> and even higher if QRM warrants. Callers who s-p-r-e-a-d o-u-t are more
>> likely to be copied.
>>
>> If you've already worked us in any mode, please do not call again --
>> give others a chance.
>>
>> If we call "CQ QRP", we will listen for stations running 100 W or less
>> to a single yagi. Please do not answer such a CQ if you are running more
>> power or have a larger antenna.
>>
>> On April 18, if we reach a condition where most calling stations have
>> been worked, and we judge that operating in the digital mode JT65B would
>> produce a higher QSO rate, we will switch to JT65B.
>>
>> Note that any of these planned operating strategies may be changed as
>> circumstances dictate.
>>
>> We are extremely fortunate to have been granted access to the world's
>> largest radio telescope for this amateur radio good-will event. We look
>> forward to working as many stations as possible in the alloted time!
>>
>> > From QRZ.COM
>>
>> KB1MGI
>>
>> Moon-Net Email reflector
>>
>> http://list- serv.davidv. net/mailman/ ...erv.davidv. net
>>
>> Moon Bounce information
>>
>> http://www.vhfdx. info/eme. html
>>
>> UK Ham makes EME contact with just 25 watts
>>
>> http://www.southgat earc.org/ news/jan. ..me_contact. htm
>>
>> Earth-Moon-Earth with 20 Watts
>>
>> http://www.southgat earc.org/ news/jan. ..h_20_watts. htm
>>
>> WSJT Software for EME
>>
>> http://www.physics. princeton. edu/pulsar/ K1JT/
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
>
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@xxxxx.xxx. Opinions expressed are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 5, Issue 158
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