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G4EBT > PACKET 31.08.09 14:07l 217 Lines 7381 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
BID : 581065G4EBT
Read: GUEST
Subj: GB v VK (packet content) VK2TV
Path: IZ3LSV<IK2XDE<F8KFY<ON0AR<GB7FCR
Sent: 090831/1023Z @:GB7FCR.#16.GBR.EU #:31327 [Blackpool] FBB-7.03a $:581065G4
From: G4EBT@GB7FCR.#16.GBR.EU
To : PACKET@WW
Ray, VK2TV, wrote:
> There is no compulsion for users to read anything that my bbs carries
> and it is not my right to reduce their choice of mail options, provided
> my licence isn't at risk. If it's legal it's welcome here.
Exactly so, and that's a judgement each sysop must make.
I think some sysops cut their users a bit too much slack., but I didn't
appreciate how much unsuitable stuff never sees the light of day until
Trev, M1CUK, recently put me in the picture.
Sysops wouldn't let people into their shack to behave on air as they
sometimes do on packet, but I think sysops are reluctant to be labelled
"packet police", "band bobbies", or pehaps in Oz, "tall poppies".
However, moderation in not the same thing as censorship.
>One major reason for amateurs moving away from packet is
>sysops deciding what users can or cannot have access to.
And not just sysops either.
I became involved in this in 2002, when two VKs were trying to boss
everyone around on packet, telling people what they could/couldn't
should/shouldn't write.
EG: "politics and religion aren't allowed, you could come to the attention
of the authorities - you fellas wouldn't get away with that down here".
Only the names have been withheld to protect the guilty.
Typically:
A VK wrongly wrote:
>Keep religion and politics off amateur radio. They have on place there.
EU amateur responded:
>In that case, nor does truth and honesty, and you wonder
>why the world is going to Hades in a handcart.
VK responded:
>Your remark about truth and honesty is completely irrelevant.
(How prophetic that has proved to be).
It was nonsense.
The attacks weren't on me (I'd never written a religious or political bull
up to then), but I obtained a copy of the VK regs and put out a sensible
bull explaining them.
I thought I was dealing with sensible rational people who'd see the light.
Big mistake.
One said "where did I get the regs" (two mouse clicks), and: the last time
he checked they were out of print. (Statutory instruments never go out of
print).
Then he said "they're just more clutter in the shack anyway". So in a
week, he went from saying we should obey the regs (as he saw it) to saying
they
were tantamount to junk mail.
The other had said "don't talk about the war" then wrote a bull about
the merits of depleted uranium-tipped bombs being used against civilians
in Iraq.
Neither grasped even the most elementary differences between packet and
on-air QSOs. No-one on packet engages in a QSO. A bull isn't one half
of a QSO - it's more like a CQ call which can be responded to or ignored.
It isn't complicated:
*Read or kill.
*Ignore or respond in a bull or an SP.
*If you disagree with someone's point of view,
try to do it without being disagreeable.
*DON'T SHOUT
A topic in which one isn't interested needn't be downloaded or responded
to. No-one can be a hostage to fortune as they could on air, by a complete
stranger forcing unwelcome religious or political views upon them.
But to continually tell people they must not write perfectly legal
messages may, as a course of conduct over time, in itself amount to
unwarranted, unlawful interference.
I'd repeat Article 19 of the ICCPR, (protected by law in the UK
and rest of Europe, the US and Canada but not in Oz):
1. Everyone shall have the right to hold opinions without interference.
So what we had was VKs abusing rights they don't have in law,
to interfere with the rights of others who are protected by law.
Hardly what I'd call "the ham spirit" or "common good manners".
It's not even lawful.
2. Everyone shall have the right to freedom of expression; this right
shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of
all kinds, regardless of frontiers, either orally, in writing or in print,
in the form of art, or through any other media of his choice.
End quote.
I doubt many VKs fully understand their statutory obligations,
for two key reasons:
Firstly the VK regs do not meet the regulatory principles for all
rules and regs to be written in clear and unambiguous language.
(They aren't).
Secondly VKs don't see the relevant parts of the 400+ pages of
the Radiocommunications Act 1992, with which they must comply.
The VK Regs are a bit of a mess with gaping holes, in need of revision.
The Radiocommunications Licence Conditions (Amateur Licence) Determination
No. 1 of 1997 as amended, (43 pages) are made under paragraph 107 (1) (f)
and subsection 179 (1) of the Radiocommunications Act 1992.
They do not define the ambiguous term "intercommunication".
That is not in accordance with regulatory principles.
The regs only say what messages you can't send - not what you can.
What you can say (as a VK) derives not from the law, but only from ICCPR
obligations. In the UK and rest of Europe (not simply the EU), citizens
have legal rights under various Human Rights Acts derived from UN
Conventions, and have recourse to the European Court of Human Rights.
Other countries such as Canada and America also have constitutional
rights.
Australians have no such rights or redress in domestic law. What they have
is a concession, rather than a right, and that concession (ICCPR Article
17) is not spelt out in the regs, because it isn't the law as such.
Here's the relevant clip of the terms of the VK licence as to messages:
Quote:
Part 2 Conditions for every amateur licence:
4 Conditions:
Every amateur licence is subject to the conditions in this Part relating
to the operation of any amateur station under the licence by the licensee.
5 Communication by an amateur station:
(1) The licensee must not solicit a message that is to be transmitted
on behalf of a third party unless the message relates to a disaster.
(2) The licensee must not transmit a message on behalf of a third party:
(a) enabling any person to obtain a financial
gain or other reward, directly or indirectly; or
(b) relating to the commercial or financial affairs of any person.
(3) The licensee must not transmit messages to an amateur station
in a foreign country if ACMA [now the ACA] has published a notice
in the Gazette to the effect that the government of that country
has given notice that it objects to the transmission and reception
of messages between amateur stations in that country and amateur
stations outside that country.
6 Use of an amateur station:
The licensee:
(a) must use an amateur station solely for the purpose of:
(i) self training in radiocommunications; or
(ii) intercommunications; or
(iii) technical investigations into radiocommunications; or
(iv) transmitting news and information services related to the
operation of amateur stations, as a means of facilitating
intercommunication; and
(b) must not use an amateur station for financial gain; and
(c) must not transmit:
(i) a message that is, or includes, an advertisement; or
(ii) any form of entertainment
End quote.
When I get a "round tuit", I'll mention the Radiocommunications
Act and comment on the lack of a Bill of Rights in Oz.
Crickey 7k+.
But it is about more than 500 pages of VK regs, and the ICCPR.
Quite succinct really:-)
Best wishes
David, G4EBT @ GB7FCR
Cottingham, East Yorkshire.
Message timed: 10:46 on 2009-Aug-31
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